Why do most published works in medical imaging try to reduce false positives?Binary classification of similar images with small region of interestUnsupervised learning if existing image captions match the imagesImage classification: Strategies for minimal input countHow to maximize recall?Multi Class + Negative Class Image Classification StrategiesWhy the performance of VGG-16 is better than Inception V3?Detecting if an image can be made BW/Greyscale/ColourNeed help with confusing dataset formats for Images and annotationsAudio files and their corresponding spectrograms for image classification processHow can one quickly look up people from a large database?

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Why do most published works in medical imaging try to reduce false positives?


Binary classification of similar images with small region of interestUnsupervised learning if existing image captions match the imagesImage classification: Strategies for minimal input countHow to maximize recall?Multi Class + Negative Class Image Classification StrategiesWhy the performance of VGG-16 is better than Inception V3?Detecting if an image can be made BW/Greyscale/ColourNeed help with confusing dataset formats for Images and annotationsAudio files and their corresponding spectrograms for image classification processHow can one quickly look up people from a large database?













9












$begingroup$


In medical image processing most of the published works try to reduce false positive rate (FPR) while in reality false negatives are more dangerous than false positives. What is the rationale behind it?










share|improve this question











$endgroup$
















    9












    $begingroup$


    In medical image processing most of the published works try to reduce false positive rate (FPR) while in reality false negatives are more dangerous than false positives. What is the rationale behind it?










    share|improve this question











    $endgroup$














      9












      9








      9


      1



      $begingroup$


      In medical image processing most of the published works try to reduce false positive rate (FPR) while in reality false negatives are more dangerous than false positives. What is the rationale behind it?










      share|improve this question











      $endgroup$




      In medical image processing most of the published works try to reduce false positive rate (FPR) while in reality false negatives are more dangerous than false positives. What is the rationale behind it?







      image-classification image-recognition






      share|improve this question















      share|improve this question













      share|improve this question




      share|improve this question








      edited 46 mins ago









      Community

      1




      1










      asked 22 hours ago









      SoKSoK

      37814




      37814




















          5 Answers
          5






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          10












          $begingroup$

          You know the story of the boy who cried wolf, right?



          It's the same idea. After some classifier gives false alarms (cries wolf) so many times, the medical staff will turn it off or ignore it.



          "Oh, this again! NOPE!"



          At least with the bioengineering group I've worked with, the emphasis is on reducing FPR specifically because the goal is to make a tool that will alert physicians to potential pathology, and they've told us that they will ignore a product that cries wolf too much.



          For a product that aids physicians, we have to appeal to their psychology, despite the legitimate argument that missing the wolf on the farm is worse than crying wolf.



          Edit: Decreasing false positives also has a legitimate argument. If your computer keeps crying wolf while getting the occasional true positive (and catching most of the true positives), it's effectively saying that someone might be sick. They're in the hospital. The physician knows that the patient might be sick.






          share|improve this answer











          $endgroup$




















            10












            $begingroup$

            TL;DR: diseases are rare, so the absolute number of false positives is a lot more than that of false negatives.



            Let's assume that our system has the same false positive and false negative rate of 1% (pretty good!), and that we're detecting the presence of new cancers this year: 439.2 / 100,000 people, or 0.5% of the population. [source]



            • No cancer, no detection: 99.5% x 99% = 98.5% (98.505%)

            • No cancer, detection: 99.5% x 1% = 1.0% (0.995%)

            • Cancer, detection: 0.5% x 99% = 0.5% (0.495%)

            • Cancer, no detection: 0.5% x 1% = 0.005%

            So we can see that we have a problem: for everyone who has cancer, two people who didn't have cancer wind up with invasive surgery, chemotherapy or radiotherapy.



            For every person who fails to have a present cancer detected, two hundred people receive actively harmful treatment they didn't need and can't really afford.






            share|improve this answer








            New contributor



            Dragon is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
            Check out our Code of Conduct.





            $endgroup$












            • $begingroup$
              For many screening applications the incidence (no of newly diagnosed disease per 100000 population) is acually even lower: the 0.5 % is total cancer incidence whereas screening programs target specific types of cancer.
              $endgroup$
              – cbeleites
              11 hours ago






            • 2




              $begingroup$
              @cbeleites, to take a concrete example, pancreatic adenocarcinoma is nearly always fatal because it's asymptomatic until it reaches an advanced stage. If you were to apply a screening test with a 1% false positive/1% false negative rate to the entire population of the United States, you'd identify about three million cases, of which only 46,000 actually have the cancer, giving a positive predictive value of only 1.5%.
              $endgroup$
              – Mark
              9 hours ago


















            1












            $begingroup$

            Summary: the question probably* isn't whether one false negative is worse than one false positive, it's probably* more like whether 500 false positives are acceptable to get down to one false negative.



            * depends on the application




            Let me expand a bit on @Dragon's answer:



            • Screening means that we're looking for disease among a seemingly healthy population. As @Dragon explained, for these we need extremely low FPR (or high Sensitivity), otherwise we'll end up with many more false positives than true positives. I.e., the Positive Predictive Value (# truly diseased among all diagnosed positive) would be inacceptably low.


            • Sensitivity (TPR) and Specificity (TNR) are easy to measure for a diagnostic system: take a number of truly (non)diseased cases and measure the fraction of correctly detected ones.


            • OTOH, both from doctors' and patients' point of view, the predicitive values are more to the point. They are the "inverse" to Sensitivity and specificity and tell you among all positive (negative) predictions, what fraction is correct. In other words, after the test said "disease" what is the probability that the patient actually does have the disease.


            • As @Dragon showed you, the incidence (or prevalence, depending on what test we're talking about) plays a crucial role here. Incidence is low in all kinds of screening/early cancer diagnosis applications.

              To illustrate this, ovarian cancer screening for post-menopausal women has a prevalence of 0.04 % in the general population and 0.5 % in high-risk women with family history and/or known mutations of tumor suppressor genes BRCA1 and 2 [Buchen, L. Cancer: Missing the mark. Nature, 2011, 471, 428-432]


            • So the question is typically not whether one false negative is worse than one false positive, but even 99 % specificity (1 % FPR) and 95 % sensitivity (numbers taken from the paper linked above) then means roughly 500 false positives for each false negative.


            • As a side note, also keep in mind that early cancer diagnosis in itself is no magic cure for cancer. E.g. for breast cancer screening mammography, only 3 - 13 % of the true positive patients actually benefit from the screening.

              So we also need to keep an eye on the number of false positives for each benefitting patient. E.g. for mammography, together with these numbers, a rough guesstimate it that we have somewhere in the range of 400 - 1800 false positives per benefitting true positive (39 - 49 year old group).



            • With hundreds of false positives per false negative (and also maybe hundreds or even thousands of false positives per patient benefitting from the screening) the situation isn't as clear as "is one missed cancer worse than one false positive cancer diagnosis": false positives do have an impact, ranging from psychological and psycho-somatic (worrying that you have cancer in itself isn't healthy) to physical risks of follow-up diagnoses such as biopsy (which is a small surgery, and as such comes with its own risks).

              Even if the impact of one false positive is small, the corresponding risks may add up substantially if hundreds of false positives have to be considered.



              Suggested reading: Gerd Gigerenzer: Risk Savvy: How to Make Good Decisions (2014).



            • Still, what PPV and NPV are needed to make a diagnostic test useful is highly dependend on the application.

              As explained, in screening for early cancer detection the focus is usually on PPV, i.e. making sure you do not cause too much harm by false negatives: finding a sizeable fraction (even if not all) of the early cancer patients is already an improvement over the status quo without screening.

              OTOH, HIV test in blood donations focuses first on NPV (i.e. making sure the blood is HIV-free). Still, in a 2nd (and 3rd) step, false positives are then reduced by applying further tests before worrying people with (false) positive HIV test results.


            • Last but not least, there are also medical testing applications where the incidences or prevalences aren't as extreme as they usually are in screening of not-particularly-high-risk populations, e.g. some differential diagnoses.






            share|improve this answer











            $endgroup$




















              0












              $begingroup$

              False Positive Rate (FPR) also known as false alarm rate (FAR); A large False Positive Rate can produce a poor performance of the Medical Image Detection System. A false positive is where you receive a positive result for a test, when you should have received a negative results. For example A pregnancy test is positive, when in fact the person isn't pregnant.






              share|improve this answer








              New contributor



              EricAtHaufe is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
              Check out our Code of Conduct.





              $endgroup$








              • 1




                $begingroup$
                This is not answering the question. OP is not asking what false positive means, but why it's deemed more important than false negative.
                $endgroup$
                – Llewellyn
                12 hours ago


















              0












              $begingroup$

              Clinician's time is precious



              From within the field of medicine, clinicians often have a wide variety of illnesses to try to detect and diagnose, and this is a time consuming process. A tool that presents a false positive (even if at a low rate) is less useful because it's not possible to trust that diagnosis, meaning every time it makes that diagnosis, it needs to be checked. Think of it like the WebMD of software - everything is a sign of cancer!



              A tool that presents false negatives, but always presents true positives, is far more useful, as a clinician doesn't need to waste time double-checking or second guessing the diagnosis. If it marks someone as being ill with a specific diagnosis, job done. If it doesn't, the people which aren't highlighted as being ill will receive additional tests anyway.



              It's better to have a tool that can accurately identify even a single trait of an illness, than a tool that maybe fudges multiple traits.






              share|improve this answer








              New contributor



              SSight3 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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                5 Answers
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                5 Answers
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                active

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                10












                $begingroup$

                You know the story of the boy who cried wolf, right?



                It's the same idea. After some classifier gives false alarms (cries wolf) so many times, the medical staff will turn it off or ignore it.



                "Oh, this again! NOPE!"



                At least with the bioengineering group I've worked with, the emphasis is on reducing FPR specifically because the goal is to make a tool that will alert physicians to potential pathology, and they've told us that they will ignore a product that cries wolf too much.



                For a product that aids physicians, we have to appeal to their psychology, despite the legitimate argument that missing the wolf on the farm is worse than crying wolf.



                Edit: Decreasing false positives also has a legitimate argument. If your computer keeps crying wolf while getting the occasional true positive (and catching most of the true positives), it's effectively saying that someone might be sick. They're in the hospital. The physician knows that the patient might be sick.






                share|improve this answer











                $endgroup$

















                  10












                  $begingroup$

                  You know the story of the boy who cried wolf, right?



                  It's the same idea. After some classifier gives false alarms (cries wolf) so many times, the medical staff will turn it off or ignore it.



                  "Oh, this again! NOPE!"



                  At least with the bioengineering group I've worked with, the emphasis is on reducing FPR specifically because the goal is to make a tool that will alert physicians to potential pathology, and they've told us that they will ignore a product that cries wolf too much.



                  For a product that aids physicians, we have to appeal to their psychology, despite the legitimate argument that missing the wolf on the farm is worse than crying wolf.



                  Edit: Decreasing false positives also has a legitimate argument. If your computer keeps crying wolf while getting the occasional true positive (and catching most of the true positives), it's effectively saying that someone might be sick. They're in the hospital. The physician knows that the patient might be sick.






                  share|improve this answer











                  $endgroup$















                    10












                    10








                    10





                    $begingroup$

                    You know the story of the boy who cried wolf, right?



                    It's the same idea. After some classifier gives false alarms (cries wolf) so many times, the medical staff will turn it off or ignore it.



                    "Oh, this again! NOPE!"



                    At least with the bioengineering group I've worked with, the emphasis is on reducing FPR specifically because the goal is to make a tool that will alert physicians to potential pathology, and they've told us that they will ignore a product that cries wolf too much.



                    For a product that aids physicians, we have to appeal to their psychology, despite the legitimate argument that missing the wolf on the farm is worse than crying wolf.



                    Edit: Decreasing false positives also has a legitimate argument. If your computer keeps crying wolf while getting the occasional true positive (and catching most of the true positives), it's effectively saying that someone might be sick. They're in the hospital. The physician knows that the patient might be sick.






                    share|improve this answer











                    $endgroup$



                    You know the story of the boy who cried wolf, right?



                    It's the same idea. After some classifier gives false alarms (cries wolf) so many times, the medical staff will turn it off or ignore it.



                    "Oh, this again! NOPE!"



                    At least with the bioengineering group I've worked with, the emphasis is on reducing FPR specifically because the goal is to make a tool that will alert physicians to potential pathology, and they've told us that they will ignore a product that cries wolf too much.



                    For a product that aids physicians, we have to appeal to their psychology, despite the legitimate argument that missing the wolf on the farm is worse than crying wolf.



                    Edit: Decreasing false positives also has a legitimate argument. If your computer keeps crying wolf while getting the occasional true positive (and catching most of the true positives), it's effectively saying that someone might be sick. They're in the hospital. The physician knows that the patient might be sick.







                    share|improve this answer














                    share|improve this answer



                    share|improve this answer








                    edited 16 hours ago

























                    answered 17 hours ago









                    DaveDave

                    1115




                    1115





















                        10












                        $begingroup$

                        TL;DR: diseases are rare, so the absolute number of false positives is a lot more than that of false negatives.



                        Let's assume that our system has the same false positive and false negative rate of 1% (pretty good!), and that we're detecting the presence of new cancers this year: 439.2 / 100,000 people, or 0.5% of the population. [source]



                        • No cancer, no detection: 99.5% x 99% = 98.5% (98.505%)

                        • No cancer, detection: 99.5% x 1% = 1.0% (0.995%)

                        • Cancer, detection: 0.5% x 99% = 0.5% (0.495%)

                        • Cancer, no detection: 0.5% x 1% = 0.005%

                        So we can see that we have a problem: for everyone who has cancer, two people who didn't have cancer wind up with invasive surgery, chemotherapy or radiotherapy.



                        For every person who fails to have a present cancer detected, two hundred people receive actively harmful treatment they didn't need and can't really afford.






                        share|improve this answer








                        New contributor



                        Dragon is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                        Check out our Code of Conduct.





                        $endgroup$












                        • $begingroup$
                          For many screening applications the incidence (no of newly diagnosed disease per 100000 population) is acually even lower: the 0.5 % is total cancer incidence whereas screening programs target specific types of cancer.
                          $endgroup$
                          – cbeleites
                          11 hours ago






                        • 2




                          $begingroup$
                          @cbeleites, to take a concrete example, pancreatic adenocarcinoma is nearly always fatal because it's asymptomatic until it reaches an advanced stage. If you were to apply a screening test with a 1% false positive/1% false negative rate to the entire population of the United States, you'd identify about three million cases, of which only 46,000 actually have the cancer, giving a positive predictive value of only 1.5%.
                          $endgroup$
                          – Mark
                          9 hours ago















                        10












                        $begingroup$

                        TL;DR: diseases are rare, so the absolute number of false positives is a lot more than that of false negatives.



                        Let's assume that our system has the same false positive and false negative rate of 1% (pretty good!), and that we're detecting the presence of new cancers this year: 439.2 / 100,000 people, or 0.5% of the population. [source]



                        • No cancer, no detection: 99.5% x 99% = 98.5% (98.505%)

                        • No cancer, detection: 99.5% x 1% = 1.0% (0.995%)

                        • Cancer, detection: 0.5% x 99% = 0.5% (0.495%)

                        • Cancer, no detection: 0.5% x 1% = 0.005%

                        So we can see that we have a problem: for everyone who has cancer, two people who didn't have cancer wind up with invasive surgery, chemotherapy or radiotherapy.



                        For every person who fails to have a present cancer detected, two hundred people receive actively harmful treatment they didn't need and can't really afford.






                        share|improve this answer








                        New contributor



                        Dragon is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                        Check out our Code of Conduct.





                        $endgroup$












                        • $begingroup$
                          For many screening applications the incidence (no of newly diagnosed disease per 100000 population) is acually even lower: the 0.5 % is total cancer incidence whereas screening programs target specific types of cancer.
                          $endgroup$
                          – cbeleites
                          11 hours ago






                        • 2




                          $begingroup$
                          @cbeleites, to take a concrete example, pancreatic adenocarcinoma is nearly always fatal because it's asymptomatic until it reaches an advanced stage. If you were to apply a screening test with a 1% false positive/1% false negative rate to the entire population of the United States, you'd identify about three million cases, of which only 46,000 actually have the cancer, giving a positive predictive value of only 1.5%.
                          $endgroup$
                          – Mark
                          9 hours ago













                        10












                        10








                        10





                        $begingroup$

                        TL;DR: diseases are rare, so the absolute number of false positives is a lot more than that of false negatives.



                        Let's assume that our system has the same false positive and false negative rate of 1% (pretty good!), and that we're detecting the presence of new cancers this year: 439.2 / 100,000 people, or 0.5% of the population. [source]



                        • No cancer, no detection: 99.5% x 99% = 98.5% (98.505%)

                        • No cancer, detection: 99.5% x 1% = 1.0% (0.995%)

                        • Cancer, detection: 0.5% x 99% = 0.5% (0.495%)

                        • Cancer, no detection: 0.5% x 1% = 0.005%

                        So we can see that we have a problem: for everyone who has cancer, two people who didn't have cancer wind up with invasive surgery, chemotherapy or radiotherapy.



                        For every person who fails to have a present cancer detected, two hundred people receive actively harmful treatment they didn't need and can't really afford.






                        share|improve this answer








                        New contributor



                        Dragon is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                        Check out our Code of Conduct.





                        $endgroup$



                        TL;DR: diseases are rare, so the absolute number of false positives is a lot more than that of false negatives.



                        Let's assume that our system has the same false positive and false negative rate of 1% (pretty good!), and that we're detecting the presence of new cancers this year: 439.2 / 100,000 people, or 0.5% of the population. [source]



                        • No cancer, no detection: 99.5% x 99% = 98.5% (98.505%)

                        • No cancer, detection: 99.5% x 1% = 1.0% (0.995%)

                        • Cancer, detection: 0.5% x 99% = 0.5% (0.495%)

                        • Cancer, no detection: 0.5% x 1% = 0.005%

                        So we can see that we have a problem: for everyone who has cancer, two people who didn't have cancer wind up with invasive surgery, chemotherapy or radiotherapy.



                        For every person who fails to have a present cancer detected, two hundred people receive actively harmful treatment they didn't need and can't really afford.







                        share|improve this answer








                        New contributor



                        Dragon is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                        Check out our Code of Conduct.








                        share|improve this answer



                        share|improve this answer






                        New contributor



                        Dragon is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                        Check out our Code of Conduct.








                        answered 12 hours ago









                        DragonDragon

                        2012




                        2012




                        New contributor



                        Dragon is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                        Check out our Code of Conduct.




                        New contributor




                        Dragon is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                        Check out our Code of Conduct.













                        • $begingroup$
                          For many screening applications the incidence (no of newly diagnosed disease per 100000 population) is acually even lower: the 0.5 % is total cancer incidence whereas screening programs target specific types of cancer.
                          $endgroup$
                          – cbeleites
                          11 hours ago






                        • 2




                          $begingroup$
                          @cbeleites, to take a concrete example, pancreatic adenocarcinoma is nearly always fatal because it's asymptomatic until it reaches an advanced stage. If you were to apply a screening test with a 1% false positive/1% false negative rate to the entire population of the United States, you'd identify about three million cases, of which only 46,000 actually have the cancer, giving a positive predictive value of only 1.5%.
                          $endgroup$
                          – Mark
                          9 hours ago
















                        • $begingroup$
                          For many screening applications the incidence (no of newly diagnosed disease per 100000 population) is acually even lower: the 0.5 % is total cancer incidence whereas screening programs target specific types of cancer.
                          $endgroup$
                          – cbeleites
                          11 hours ago






                        • 2




                          $begingroup$
                          @cbeleites, to take a concrete example, pancreatic adenocarcinoma is nearly always fatal because it's asymptomatic until it reaches an advanced stage. If you were to apply a screening test with a 1% false positive/1% false negative rate to the entire population of the United States, you'd identify about three million cases, of which only 46,000 actually have the cancer, giving a positive predictive value of only 1.5%.
                          $endgroup$
                          – Mark
                          9 hours ago















                        $begingroup$
                        For many screening applications the incidence (no of newly diagnosed disease per 100000 population) is acually even lower: the 0.5 % is total cancer incidence whereas screening programs target specific types of cancer.
                        $endgroup$
                        – cbeleites
                        11 hours ago




                        $begingroup$
                        For many screening applications the incidence (no of newly diagnosed disease per 100000 population) is acually even lower: the 0.5 % is total cancer incidence whereas screening programs target specific types of cancer.
                        $endgroup$
                        – cbeleites
                        11 hours ago




                        2




                        2




                        $begingroup$
                        @cbeleites, to take a concrete example, pancreatic adenocarcinoma is nearly always fatal because it's asymptomatic until it reaches an advanced stage. If you were to apply a screening test with a 1% false positive/1% false negative rate to the entire population of the United States, you'd identify about three million cases, of which only 46,000 actually have the cancer, giving a positive predictive value of only 1.5%.
                        $endgroup$
                        – Mark
                        9 hours ago




                        $begingroup$
                        @cbeleites, to take a concrete example, pancreatic adenocarcinoma is nearly always fatal because it's asymptomatic until it reaches an advanced stage. If you were to apply a screening test with a 1% false positive/1% false negative rate to the entire population of the United States, you'd identify about three million cases, of which only 46,000 actually have the cancer, giving a positive predictive value of only 1.5%.
                        $endgroup$
                        – Mark
                        9 hours ago











                        1












                        $begingroup$

                        Summary: the question probably* isn't whether one false negative is worse than one false positive, it's probably* more like whether 500 false positives are acceptable to get down to one false negative.



                        * depends on the application




                        Let me expand a bit on @Dragon's answer:



                        • Screening means that we're looking for disease among a seemingly healthy population. As @Dragon explained, for these we need extremely low FPR (or high Sensitivity), otherwise we'll end up with many more false positives than true positives. I.e., the Positive Predictive Value (# truly diseased among all diagnosed positive) would be inacceptably low.


                        • Sensitivity (TPR) and Specificity (TNR) are easy to measure for a diagnostic system: take a number of truly (non)diseased cases and measure the fraction of correctly detected ones.


                        • OTOH, both from doctors' and patients' point of view, the predicitive values are more to the point. They are the "inverse" to Sensitivity and specificity and tell you among all positive (negative) predictions, what fraction is correct. In other words, after the test said "disease" what is the probability that the patient actually does have the disease.


                        • As @Dragon showed you, the incidence (or prevalence, depending on what test we're talking about) plays a crucial role here. Incidence is low in all kinds of screening/early cancer diagnosis applications.

                          To illustrate this, ovarian cancer screening for post-menopausal women has a prevalence of 0.04 % in the general population and 0.5 % in high-risk women with family history and/or known mutations of tumor suppressor genes BRCA1 and 2 [Buchen, L. Cancer: Missing the mark. Nature, 2011, 471, 428-432]


                        • So the question is typically not whether one false negative is worse than one false positive, but even 99 % specificity (1 % FPR) and 95 % sensitivity (numbers taken from the paper linked above) then means roughly 500 false positives for each false negative.


                        • As a side note, also keep in mind that early cancer diagnosis in itself is no magic cure for cancer. E.g. for breast cancer screening mammography, only 3 - 13 % of the true positive patients actually benefit from the screening.

                          So we also need to keep an eye on the number of false positives for each benefitting patient. E.g. for mammography, together with these numbers, a rough guesstimate it that we have somewhere in the range of 400 - 1800 false positives per benefitting true positive (39 - 49 year old group).



                        • With hundreds of false positives per false negative (and also maybe hundreds or even thousands of false positives per patient benefitting from the screening) the situation isn't as clear as "is one missed cancer worse than one false positive cancer diagnosis": false positives do have an impact, ranging from psychological and psycho-somatic (worrying that you have cancer in itself isn't healthy) to physical risks of follow-up diagnoses such as biopsy (which is a small surgery, and as such comes with its own risks).

                          Even if the impact of one false positive is small, the corresponding risks may add up substantially if hundreds of false positives have to be considered.



                          Suggested reading: Gerd Gigerenzer: Risk Savvy: How to Make Good Decisions (2014).



                        • Still, what PPV and NPV are needed to make a diagnostic test useful is highly dependend on the application.

                          As explained, in screening for early cancer detection the focus is usually on PPV, i.e. making sure you do not cause too much harm by false negatives: finding a sizeable fraction (even if not all) of the early cancer patients is already an improvement over the status quo without screening.

                          OTOH, HIV test in blood donations focuses first on NPV (i.e. making sure the blood is HIV-free). Still, in a 2nd (and 3rd) step, false positives are then reduced by applying further tests before worrying people with (false) positive HIV test results.


                        • Last but not least, there are also medical testing applications where the incidences or prevalences aren't as extreme as they usually are in screening of not-particularly-high-risk populations, e.g. some differential diagnoses.






                        share|improve this answer











                        $endgroup$

















                          1












                          $begingroup$

                          Summary: the question probably* isn't whether one false negative is worse than one false positive, it's probably* more like whether 500 false positives are acceptable to get down to one false negative.



                          * depends on the application




                          Let me expand a bit on @Dragon's answer:



                          • Screening means that we're looking for disease among a seemingly healthy population. As @Dragon explained, for these we need extremely low FPR (or high Sensitivity), otherwise we'll end up with many more false positives than true positives. I.e., the Positive Predictive Value (# truly diseased among all diagnosed positive) would be inacceptably low.


                          • Sensitivity (TPR) and Specificity (TNR) are easy to measure for a diagnostic system: take a number of truly (non)diseased cases and measure the fraction of correctly detected ones.


                          • OTOH, both from doctors' and patients' point of view, the predicitive values are more to the point. They are the "inverse" to Sensitivity and specificity and tell you among all positive (negative) predictions, what fraction is correct. In other words, after the test said "disease" what is the probability that the patient actually does have the disease.


                          • As @Dragon showed you, the incidence (or prevalence, depending on what test we're talking about) plays a crucial role here. Incidence is low in all kinds of screening/early cancer diagnosis applications.

                            To illustrate this, ovarian cancer screening for post-menopausal women has a prevalence of 0.04 % in the general population and 0.5 % in high-risk women with family history and/or known mutations of tumor suppressor genes BRCA1 and 2 [Buchen, L. Cancer: Missing the mark. Nature, 2011, 471, 428-432]


                          • So the question is typically not whether one false negative is worse than one false positive, but even 99 % specificity (1 % FPR) and 95 % sensitivity (numbers taken from the paper linked above) then means roughly 500 false positives for each false negative.


                          • As a side note, also keep in mind that early cancer diagnosis in itself is no magic cure for cancer. E.g. for breast cancer screening mammography, only 3 - 13 % of the true positive patients actually benefit from the screening.

                            So we also need to keep an eye on the number of false positives for each benefitting patient. E.g. for mammography, together with these numbers, a rough guesstimate it that we have somewhere in the range of 400 - 1800 false positives per benefitting true positive (39 - 49 year old group).



                          • With hundreds of false positives per false negative (and also maybe hundreds or even thousands of false positives per patient benefitting from the screening) the situation isn't as clear as "is one missed cancer worse than one false positive cancer diagnosis": false positives do have an impact, ranging from psychological and psycho-somatic (worrying that you have cancer in itself isn't healthy) to physical risks of follow-up diagnoses such as biopsy (which is a small surgery, and as such comes with its own risks).

                            Even if the impact of one false positive is small, the corresponding risks may add up substantially if hundreds of false positives have to be considered.



                            Suggested reading: Gerd Gigerenzer: Risk Savvy: How to Make Good Decisions (2014).



                          • Still, what PPV and NPV are needed to make a diagnostic test useful is highly dependend on the application.

                            As explained, in screening for early cancer detection the focus is usually on PPV, i.e. making sure you do not cause too much harm by false negatives: finding a sizeable fraction (even if not all) of the early cancer patients is already an improvement over the status quo without screening.

                            OTOH, HIV test in blood donations focuses first on NPV (i.e. making sure the blood is HIV-free). Still, in a 2nd (and 3rd) step, false positives are then reduced by applying further tests before worrying people with (false) positive HIV test results.


                          • Last but not least, there are also medical testing applications where the incidences or prevalences aren't as extreme as they usually are in screening of not-particularly-high-risk populations, e.g. some differential diagnoses.






                          share|improve this answer











                          $endgroup$















                            1












                            1








                            1





                            $begingroup$

                            Summary: the question probably* isn't whether one false negative is worse than one false positive, it's probably* more like whether 500 false positives are acceptable to get down to one false negative.



                            * depends on the application




                            Let me expand a bit on @Dragon's answer:



                            • Screening means that we're looking for disease among a seemingly healthy population. As @Dragon explained, for these we need extremely low FPR (or high Sensitivity), otherwise we'll end up with many more false positives than true positives. I.e., the Positive Predictive Value (# truly diseased among all diagnosed positive) would be inacceptably low.


                            • Sensitivity (TPR) and Specificity (TNR) are easy to measure for a diagnostic system: take a number of truly (non)diseased cases and measure the fraction of correctly detected ones.


                            • OTOH, both from doctors' and patients' point of view, the predicitive values are more to the point. They are the "inverse" to Sensitivity and specificity and tell you among all positive (negative) predictions, what fraction is correct. In other words, after the test said "disease" what is the probability that the patient actually does have the disease.


                            • As @Dragon showed you, the incidence (or prevalence, depending on what test we're talking about) plays a crucial role here. Incidence is low in all kinds of screening/early cancer diagnosis applications.

                              To illustrate this, ovarian cancer screening for post-menopausal women has a prevalence of 0.04 % in the general population and 0.5 % in high-risk women with family history and/or known mutations of tumor suppressor genes BRCA1 and 2 [Buchen, L. Cancer: Missing the mark. Nature, 2011, 471, 428-432]


                            • So the question is typically not whether one false negative is worse than one false positive, but even 99 % specificity (1 % FPR) and 95 % sensitivity (numbers taken from the paper linked above) then means roughly 500 false positives for each false negative.


                            • As a side note, also keep in mind that early cancer diagnosis in itself is no magic cure for cancer. E.g. for breast cancer screening mammography, only 3 - 13 % of the true positive patients actually benefit from the screening.

                              So we also need to keep an eye on the number of false positives for each benefitting patient. E.g. for mammography, together with these numbers, a rough guesstimate it that we have somewhere in the range of 400 - 1800 false positives per benefitting true positive (39 - 49 year old group).



                            • With hundreds of false positives per false negative (and also maybe hundreds or even thousands of false positives per patient benefitting from the screening) the situation isn't as clear as "is one missed cancer worse than one false positive cancer diagnosis": false positives do have an impact, ranging from psychological and psycho-somatic (worrying that you have cancer in itself isn't healthy) to physical risks of follow-up diagnoses such as biopsy (which is a small surgery, and as such comes with its own risks).

                              Even if the impact of one false positive is small, the corresponding risks may add up substantially if hundreds of false positives have to be considered.



                              Suggested reading: Gerd Gigerenzer: Risk Savvy: How to Make Good Decisions (2014).



                            • Still, what PPV and NPV are needed to make a diagnostic test useful is highly dependend on the application.

                              As explained, in screening for early cancer detection the focus is usually on PPV, i.e. making sure you do not cause too much harm by false negatives: finding a sizeable fraction (even if not all) of the early cancer patients is already an improvement over the status quo without screening.

                              OTOH, HIV test in blood donations focuses first on NPV (i.e. making sure the blood is HIV-free). Still, in a 2nd (and 3rd) step, false positives are then reduced by applying further tests before worrying people with (false) positive HIV test results.


                            • Last but not least, there are also medical testing applications where the incidences or prevalences aren't as extreme as they usually are in screening of not-particularly-high-risk populations, e.g. some differential diagnoses.






                            share|improve this answer











                            $endgroup$



                            Summary: the question probably* isn't whether one false negative is worse than one false positive, it's probably* more like whether 500 false positives are acceptable to get down to one false negative.



                            * depends on the application




                            Let me expand a bit on @Dragon's answer:



                            • Screening means that we're looking for disease among a seemingly healthy population. As @Dragon explained, for these we need extremely low FPR (or high Sensitivity), otherwise we'll end up with many more false positives than true positives. I.e., the Positive Predictive Value (# truly diseased among all diagnosed positive) would be inacceptably low.


                            • Sensitivity (TPR) and Specificity (TNR) are easy to measure for a diagnostic system: take a number of truly (non)diseased cases and measure the fraction of correctly detected ones.


                            • OTOH, both from doctors' and patients' point of view, the predicitive values are more to the point. They are the "inverse" to Sensitivity and specificity and tell you among all positive (negative) predictions, what fraction is correct. In other words, after the test said "disease" what is the probability that the patient actually does have the disease.


                            • As @Dragon showed you, the incidence (or prevalence, depending on what test we're talking about) plays a crucial role here. Incidence is low in all kinds of screening/early cancer diagnosis applications.

                              To illustrate this, ovarian cancer screening for post-menopausal women has a prevalence of 0.04 % in the general population and 0.5 % in high-risk women with family history and/or known mutations of tumor suppressor genes BRCA1 and 2 [Buchen, L. Cancer: Missing the mark. Nature, 2011, 471, 428-432]


                            • So the question is typically not whether one false negative is worse than one false positive, but even 99 % specificity (1 % FPR) and 95 % sensitivity (numbers taken from the paper linked above) then means roughly 500 false positives for each false negative.


                            • As a side note, also keep in mind that early cancer diagnosis in itself is no magic cure for cancer. E.g. for breast cancer screening mammography, only 3 - 13 % of the true positive patients actually benefit from the screening.

                              So we also need to keep an eye on the number of false positives for each benefitting patient. E.g. for mammography, together with these numbers, a rough guesstimate it that we have somewhere in the range of 400 - 1800 false positives per benefitting true positive (39 - 49 year old group).



                            • With hundreds of false positives per false negative (and also maybe hundreds or even thousands of false positives per patient benefitting from the screening) the situation isn't as clear as "is one missed cancer worse than one false positive cancer diagnosis": false positives do have an impact, ranging from psychological and psycho-somatic (worrying that you have cancer in itself isn't healthy) to physical risks of follow-up diagnoses such as biopsy (which is a small surgery, and as such comes with its own risks).

                              Even if the impact of one false positive is small, the corresponding risks may add up substantially if hundreds of false positives have to be considered.



                              Suggested reading: Gerd Gigerenzer: Risk Savvy: How to Make Good Decisions (2014).



                            • Still, what PPV and NPV are needed to make a diagnostic test useful is highly dependend on the application.

                              As explained, in screening for early cancer detection the focus is usually on PPV, i.e. making sure you do not cause too much harm by false negatives: finding a sizeable fraction (even if not all) of the early cancer patients is already an improvement over the status quo without screening.

                              OTOH, HIV test in blood donations focuses first on NPV (i.e. making sure the blood is HIV-free). Still, in a 2nd (and 3rd) step, false positives are then reduced by applying further tests before worrying people with (false) positive HIV test results.


                            • Last but not least, there are also medical testing applications where the incidences or prevalences aren't as extreme as they usually are in screening of not-particularly-high-risk populations, e.g. some differential diagnoses.







                            share|improve this answer














                            share|improve this answer



                            share|improve this answer








                            edited 10 hours ago

























                            answered 10 hours ago









                            cbeleitescbeleites

                            30016




                            30016





















                                0












                                $begingroup$

                                False Positive Rate (FPR) also known as false alarm rate (FAR); A large False Positive Rate can produce a poor performance of the Medical Image Detection System. A false positive is where you receive a positive result for a test, when you should have received a negative results. For example A pregnancy test is positive, when in fact the person isn't pregnant.






                                share|improve this answer








                                New contributor



                                EricAtHaufe is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                Check out our Code of Conduct.





                                $endgroup$








                                • 1




                                  $begingroup$
                                  This is not answering the question. OP is not asking what false positive means, but why it's deemed more important than false negative.
                                  $endgroup$
                                  – Llewellyn
                                  12 hours ago















                                0












                                $begingroup$

                                False Positive Rate (FPR) also known as false alarm rate (FAR); A large False Positive Rate can produce a poor performance of the Medical Image Detection System. A false positive is where you receive a positive result for a test, when you should have received a negative results. For example A pregnancy test is positive, when in fact the person isn't pregnant.






                                share|improve this answer








                                New contributor



                                EricAtHaufe is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                Check out our Code of Conduct.





                                $endgroup$








                                • 1




                                  $begingroup$
                                  This is not answering the question. OP is not asking what false positive means, but why it's deemed more important than false negative.
                                  $endgroup$
                                  – Llewellyn
                                  12 hours ago













                                0












                                0








                                0





                                $begingroup$

                                False Positive Rate (FPR) also known as false alarm rate (FAR); A large False Positive Rate can produce a poor performance of the Medical Image Detection System. A false positive is where you receive a positive result for a test, when you should have received a negative results. For example A pregnancy test is positive, when in fact the person isn't pregnant.






                                share|improve this answer








                                New contributor



                                EricAtHaufe is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                Check out our Code of Conduct.





                                $endgroup$



                                False Positive Rate (FPR) also known as false alarm rate (FAR); A large False Positive Rate can produce a poor performance of the Medical Image Detection System. A false positive is where you receive a positive result for a test, when you should have received a negative results. For example A pregnancy test is positive, when in fact the person isn't pregnant.







                                share|improve this answer








                                New contributor



                                EricAtHaufe is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                Check out our Code of Conduct.








                                share|improve this answer



                                share|improve this answer






                                New contributor



                                EricAtHaufe is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                Check out our Code of Conduct.








                                answered 19 hours ago









                                EricAtHaufeEricAtHaufe

                                112




                                112




                                New contributor



                                EricAtHaufe is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                Check out our Code of Conduct.




                                New contributor




                                EricAtHaufe is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                Check out our Code of Conduct.









                                • 1




                                  $begingroup$
                                  This is not answering the question. OP is not asking what false positive means, but why it's deemed more important than false negative.
                                  $endgroup$
                                  – Llewellyn
                                  12 hours ago












                                • 1




                                  $begingroup$
                                  This is not answering the question. OP is not asking what false positive means, but why it's deemed more important than false negative.
                                  $endgroup$
                                  – Llewellyn
                                  12 hours ago







                                1




                                1




                                $begingroup$
                                This is not answering the question. OP is not asking what false positive means, but why it's deemed more important than false negative.
                                $endgroup$
                                – Llewellyn
                                12 hours ago




                                $begingroup$
                                This is not answering the question. OP is not asking what false positive means, but why it's deemed more important than false negative.
                                $endgroup$
                                – Llewellyn
                                12 hours ago











                                0












                                $begingroup$

                                Clinician's time is precious



                                From within the field of medicine, clinicians often have a wide variety of illnesses to try to detect and diagnose, and this is a time consuming process. A tool that presents a false positive (even if at a low rate) is less useful because it's not possible to trust that diagnosis, meaning every time it makes that diagnosis, it needs to be checked. Think of it like the WebMD of software - everything is a sign of cancer!



                                A tool that presents false negatives, but always presents true positives, is far more useful, as a clinician doesn't need to waste time double-checking or second guessing the diagnosis. If it marks someone as being ill with a specific diagnosis, job done. If it doesn't, the people which aren't highlighted as being ill will receive additional tests anyway.



                                It's better to have a tool that can accurately identify even a single trait of an illness, than a tool that maybe fudges multiple traits.






                                share|improve this answer








                                New contributor



                                SSight3 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                Check out our Code of Conduct.





                                $endgroup$

















                                  0












                                  $begingroup$

                                  Clinician's time is precious



                                  From within the field of medicine, clinicians often have a wide variety of illnesses to try to detect and diagnose, and this is a time consuming process. A tool that presents a false positive (even if at a low rate) is less useful because it's not possible to trust that diagnosis, meaning every time it makes that diagnosis, it needs to be checked. Think of it like the WebMD of software - everything is a sign of cancer!



                                  A tool that presents false negatives, but always presents true positives, is far more useful, as a clinician doesn't need to waste time double-checking or second guessing the diagnosis. If it marks someone as being ill with a specific diagnosis, job done. If it doesn't, the people which aren't highlighted as being ill will receive additional tests anyway.



                                  It's better to have a tool that can accurately identify even a single trait of an illness, than a tool that maybe fudges multiple traits.






                                  share|improve this answer








                                  New contributor



                                  SSight3 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                  Check out our Code of Conduct.





                                  $endgroup$















                                    0












                                    0








                                    0





                                    $begingroup$

                                    Clinician's time is precious



                                    From within the field of medicine, clinicians often have a wide variety of illnesses to try to detect and diagnose, and this is a time consuming process. A tool that presents a false positive (even if at a low rate) is less useful because it's not possible to trust that diagnosis, meaning every time it makes that diagnosis, it needs to be checked. Think of it like the WebMD of software - everything is a sign of cancer!



                                    A tool that presents false negatives, but always presents true positives, is far more useful, as a clinician doesn't need to waste time double-checking or second guessing the diagnosis. If it marks someone as being ill with a specific diagnosis, job done. If it doesn't, the people which aren't highlighted as being ill will receive additional tests anyway.



                                    It's better to have a tool that can accurately identify even a single trait of an illness, than a tool that maybe fudges multiple traits.






                                    share|improve this answer








                                    New contributor



                                    SSight3 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                    Check out our Code of Conduct.





                                    $endgroup$



                                    Clinician's time is precious



                                    From within the field of medicine, clinicians often have a wide variety of illnesses to try to detect and diagnose, and this is a time consuming process. A tool that presents a false positive (even if at a low rate) is less useful because it's not possible to trust that diagnosis, meaning every time it makes that diagnosis, it needs to be checked. Think of it like the WebMD of software - everything is a sign of cancer!



                                    A tool that presents false negatives, but always presents true positives, is far more useful, as a clinician doesn't need to waste time double-checking or second guessing the diagnosis. If it marks someone as being ill with a specific diagnosis, job done. If it doesn't, the people which aren't highlighted as being ill will receive additional tests anyway.



                                    It's better to have a tool that can accurately identify even a single trait of an illness, than a tool that maybe fudges multiple traits.







                                    share|improve this answer








                                    New contributor



                                    SSight3 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                    Check out our Code of Conduct.








                                    share|improve this answer



                                    share|improve this answer






                                    New contributor



                                    SSight3 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                    Check out our Code of Conduct.








                                    answered 5 hours ago









                                    SSight3SSight3

                                    101




                                    101




                                    New contributor



                                    SSight3 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                    Check out our Code of Conduct.




                                    New contributor




                                    SSight3 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                    Check out our Code of Conduct.





























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