What is the true meaning of Gibbs energy and chemical potential?Why are partial molar Gibbs energy and Gibbs energy per mol equal?Gibbs Free Energy : What is it trying to say actually?Chemical potential and it's implications in an open systemcontradiction between Gibbs energy variation and redox potentialPotential energy versus reaction coordinate (graph of Gibbs free energy)How to derive the relation between gibbs energy and equilibrium constant?Gibbs free energy in standard state vs. equilibriumDo maxima in Gibbs energy also correspond to equilibrium positions?

What‘s wrong with my proof of the Law of Total Variance?

Is a list of the most common English words copyrightable?

Are Snap and Flatpack apps safe to install? Are they "official", approved or tested for a particular distro version?

Has there been a Kraken patron for the Warlock class in Unearthed Arcana?

Neither Raman nor IR Active vibrational modes

What is this game with a red cricket pushing a ball?

Why does b+=(4,) work and b = b + (4,) doesn't work when b is a list?

Why is the empennage design of this Lockheed 1049E so complicated?

Is it now possible to undetectably cross the Arctic Ocean on ski/kayak?

Why exactly is the answer 50 ohms?

Extra battery in the bay of an HDD

What is the design rationale for having armor and magic penetration mechanics?

How to repeatedly un tar files that are within the tar itself

Paper status "Accept with Shepherd". What does it really mean?

Is there a push, in the United States, to use gender-neutral language and gender pronouns (when they are given)?

Every prime occurs as the least quadratic nonresidue

Advisor asked my whole slide presentation so she could give the presentation at international conference

Wrap the real right around the trigonometric circle (Metapost)

Should I avoid "big words" when writing to a younger audience?

Stuff the snark?

Why did Crew Dragon switch to burst disks instead of multiple check valves?

My Villain scrys on the party, but I forgot about the sensor!

In the comics, have any of the Robins called their costume "target attraction" for villains?

A curious 5x5 square



What is the true meaning of Gibbs energy and chemical potential?


Why are partial molar Gibbs energy and Gibbs energy per mol equal?Gibbs Free Energy : What is it trying to say actually?Chemical potential and it's implications in an open systemcontradiction between Gibbs energy variation and redox potentialPotential energy versus reaction coordinate (graph of Gibbs free energy)How to derive the relation between gibbs energy and equilibrium constant?Gibbs free energy in standard state vs. equilibriumDo maxima in Gibbs energy also correspond to equilibrium positions?






.everyoneloves__top-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__mid-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__bot-mid-leaderboard:empty
margin-bottom:0;









2














$begingroup$


After doing some research and reading I found some problems which I will try to state as clearly as possible.

The definition of Gibbs Free Energy says "the greatest amount of mechanical work which can be obtained from a given quantity of a certain substance in a given initial state, without increasing its total volume or allowing heat to pass to or from external bodies, except such as at the close of the processes are left in their initial condition. (I have taken the definition from the wikipedia). The equation of the Gibbs energy $$ G= H -TS$$ is also clear But the way I understand it is this: the maximum non-expansion work , like transporting an electron, breaking a chemical bond, moving real life things etc. which can be obtained from a system . These things made sense during the study of Second Law of thermodynamics but as I moved to Chemical Equilibrium these concepts began to tremble (for me).

In elementary classes it is said that Equilibrium is a state where the composition of reactants and products do not change over time, but in higher chemistry classes it is said that equilibrium is a condition corresponds to $$ Delta G = 0$$ So, my first question is how do these two concepts mean same thing? The next thing which causes problem is chemical potentials. If we adhere to the formal meaning of potential i.e. something which is stored and can be used when proper conditions are met, so chemcial potential would mean the potential of substance to react and again this is related to Gibbs energy whose definition I gave above. So, how do chemical potential and Gibbs energy can have any relation?

A question which is off topic over here but I want to mention it, why do we bother so much about standard things like $$ mu_A = mu_A^circ + RT ln(p_A)$$ why we wanted to express it in that standard (that little circle) form ?

I want to make myself clear that the conception of Gibbs energy was quite clear to me in the context of thermodynamics, we simply meant it to be the work which can be extracted from a substance, but it all-pervading use has made me to doubt myself, just like in mathematics the number $e$ appears in odd places. Even if Gibbs energy (according to the understanding that gave above in bold) is appearing mathematically then also it would be having some physical meaning because Thermodynamics and Equilibrium are natural sciences and not the mathematics.



Thank you, any help will be much appreciated.










share|improve this question











$endgroup$






















    2














    $begingroup$


    After doing some research and reading I found some problems which I will try to state as clearly as possible.

    The definition of Gibbs Free Energy says "the greatest amount of mechanical work which can be obtained from a given quantity of a certain substance in a given initial state, without increasing its total volume or allowing heat to pass to or from external bodies, except such as at the close of the processes are left in their initial condition. (I have taken the definition from the wikipedia). The equation of the Gibbs energy $$ G= H -TS$$ is also clear But the way I understand it is this: the maximum non-expansion work , like transporting an electron, breaking a chemical bond, moving real life things etc. which can be obtained from a system . These things made sense during the study of Second Law of thermodynamics but as I moved to Chemical Equilibrium these concepts began to tremble (for me).

    In elementary classes it is said that Equilibrium is a state where the composition of reactants and products do not change over time, but in higher chemistry classes it is said that equilibrium is a condition corresponds to $$ Delta G = 0$$ So, my first question is how do these two concepts mean same thing? The next thing which causes problem is chemical potentials. If we adhere to the formal meaning of potential i.e. something which is stored and can be used when proper conditions are met, so chemcial potential would mean the potential of substance to react and again this is related to Gibbs energy whose definition I gave above. So, how do chemical potential and Gibbs energy can have any relation?

    A question which is off topic over here but I want to mention it, why do we bother so much about standard things like $$ mu_A = mu_A^circ + RT ln(p_A)$$ why we wanted to express it in that standard (that little circle) form ?

    I want to make myself clear that the conception of Gibbs energy was quite clear to me in the context of thermodynamics, we simply meant it to be the work which can be extracted from a substance, but it all-pervading use has made me to doubt myself, just like in mathematics the number $e$ appears in odd places. Even if Gibbs energy (according to the understanding that gave above in bold) is appearing mathematically then also it would be having some physical meaning because Thermodynamics and Equilibrium are natural sciences and not the mathematics.



    Thank you, any help will be much appreciated.










    share|improve this question











    $endgroup$


















      2












      2








      2





      $begingroup$


      After doing some research and reading I found some problems which I will try to state as clearly as possible.

      The definition of Gibbs Free Energy says "the greatest amount of mechanical work which can be obtained from a given quantity of a certain substance in a given initial state, without increasing its total volume or allowing heat to pass to or from external bodies, except such as at the close of the processes are left in their initial condition. (I have taken the definition from the wikipedia). The equation of the Gibbs energy $$ G= H -TS$$ is also clear But the way I understand it is this: the maximum non-expansion work , like transporting an electron, breaking a chemical bond, moving real life things etc. which can be obtained from a system . These things made sense during the study of Second Law of thermodynamics but as I moved to Chemical Equilibrium these concepts began to tremble (for me).

      In elementary classes it is said that Equilibrium is a state where the composition of reactants and products do not change over time, but in higher chemistry classes it is said that equilibrium is a condition corresponds to $$ Delta G = 0$$ So, my first question is how do these two concepts mean same thing? The next thing which causes problem is chemical potentials. If we adhere to the formal meaning of potential i.e. something which is stored and can be used when proper conditions are met, so chemcial potential would mean the potential of substance to react and again this is related to Gibbs energy whose definition I gave above. So, how do chemical potential and Gibbs energy can have any relation?

      A question which is off topic over here but I want to mention it, why do we bother so much about standard things like $$ mu_A = mu_A^circ + RT ln(p_A)$$ why we wanted to express it in that standard (that little circle) form ?

      I want to make myself clear that the conception of Gibbs energy was quite clear to me in the context of thermodynamics, we simply meant it to be the work which can be extracted from a substance, but it all-pervading use has made me to doubt myself, just like in mathematics the number $e$ appears in odd places. Even if Gibbs energy (according to the understanding that gave above in bold) is appearing mathematically then also it would be having some physical meaning because Thermodynamics and Equilibrium are natural sciences and not the mathematics.



      Thank you, any help will be much appreciated.










      share|improve this question











      $endgroup$




      After doing some research and reading I found some problems which I will try to state as clearly as possible.

      The definition of Gibbs Free Energy says "the greatest amount of mechanical work which can be obtained from a given quantity of a certain substance in a given initial state, without increasing its total volume or allowing heat to pass to or from external bodies, except such as at the close of the processes are left in their initial condition. (I have taken the definition from the wikipedia). The equation of the Gibbs energy $$ G= H -TS$$ is also clear But the way I understand it is this: the maximum non-expansion work , like transporting an electron, breaking a chemical bond, moving real life things etc. which can be obtained from a system . These things made sense during the study of Second Law of thermodynamics but as I moved to Chemical Equilibrium these concepts began to tremble (for me).

      In elementary classes it is said that Equilibrium is a state where the composition of reactants and products do not change over time, but in higher chemistry classes it is said that equilibrium is a condition corresponds to $$ Delta G = 0$$ So, my first question is how do these two concepts mean same thing? The next thing which causes problem is chemical potentials. If we adhere to the formal meaning of potential i.e. something which is stored and can be used when proper conditions are met, so chemcial potential would mean the potential of substance to react and again this is related to Gibbs energy whose definition I gave above. So, how do chemical potential and Gibbs energy can have any relation?

      A question which is off topic over here but I want to mention it, why do we bother so much about standard things like $$ mu_A = mu_A^circ + RT ln(p_A)$$ why we wanted to express it in that standard (that little circle) form ?

      I want to make myself clear that the conception of Gibbs energy was quite clear to me in the context of thermodynamics, we simply meant it to be the work which can be extracted from a substance, but it all-pervading use has made me to doubt myself, just like in mathematics the number $e$ appears in odd places. Even if Gibbs energy (according to the understanding that gave above in bold) is appearing mathematically then also it would be having some physical meaning because Thermodynamics and Equilibrium are natural sciences and not the mathematics.



      Thank you, any help will be much appreciated.







      thermodynamics equilibrium






      share|improve this question















      share|improve this question













      share|improve this question




      share|improve this question



      share|improve this question








      edited 8 hours ago







      adesh mishra

















      asked 8 hours ago









      adesh mishraadesh mishra

      456 bronze badges




      456 bronze badges























          1 Answer
          1






          active

          oldest

          votes


















          3
















          $begingroup$

          Your first question:



          Before the second law was understood it used to be thought that the maximum amount of work that could be extracted from a reaction was $-Delta H$ but many experiments showed that this was not the case. It is true that, according to the first law, (the law of conservation of energy), that external work done must be equal to the loss of energy of the system, unless some heat is given to or taken from the surroundings. This was first understood by Gibbs. In an isothermal reaction working under reversible conditions, the heat absorbed from the surroundings is $TDelta S$, if this is positive then the work done will be even greater than the heat of reaction and so heat will be taken from the thermostat.



          Second question:



          The $Delta G$ you mention is actually the gradient of the free energy with extent of reaction $(partial G/partial xi)_T,p$ at constant temperature and pressure. This differential is sometimes written as $Delta G'$. The equation in general is $Delta G'=Delta G^texto+RTln(Q)$ where $Q$ is the ratio of partial pressures, for example, in a gas phase reaction. At equilibrium a plot of $G$ vs $xi$ reaches a minimum and the gradient is zero, i.e. $Delta G'=0$ then $Delta G^texto=-RTln(K_p)$ where $K_p$ is the equilibrium constant and is used instead of $Q$ at equilibrium. This reaction tells us how the position of equilibrium can be determined in terms of standard state free energies or reactants and products at 1 atm pressure.



          (The extent of reaction is zero when only reactants are present and is one when one mole of reactants have changed to product)






          share|improve this answer










          $endgroup$














          • $begingroup$
            Thank you, your answer is very nice. Can you please write something on chemical potential too?
            $endgroup$
            – adesh mishra
            5 hours ago












          Your Answer








          StackExchange.ready(function()
          var channelOptions =
          tags: "".split(" "),
          id: "431"
          ;
          initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);

          StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function()
          // Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
          if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled)
          StackExchange.using("snippets", function()
          createEditor();
          );

          else
          createEditor();

          );

          function createEditor()
          StackExchange.prepareEditor(
          heartbeatType: 'answer',
          autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
          convertImagesToLinks: false,
          noModals: true,
          showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
          reputationToPostImages: null,
          bindNavPrevention: true,
          postfix: "",
          imageUploader:
          brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
          contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/"u003ecc by-sa 4.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
          allowUrls: true
          ,
          onDemand: true,
          discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
          ,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
          );



          );














          draft saved

          draft discarded
















          StackExchange.ready(
          function ()
          StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fchemistry.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f122162%2fwhat-is-the-true-meaning-of-gibbs-energy-and-chemical-potential%23new-answer', 'question_page');

          );

          Post as a guest















          Required, but never shown


























          1 Answer
          1






          active

          oldest

          votes








          1 Answer
          1






          active

          oldest

          votes









          active

          oldest

          votes






          active

          oldest

          votes









          3
















          $begingroup$

          Your first question:



          Before the second law was understood it used to be thought that the maximum amount of work that could be extracted from a reaction was $-Delta H$ but many experiments showed that this was not the case. It is true that, according to the first law, (the law of conservation of energy), that external work done must be equal to the loss of energy of the system, unless some heat is given to or taken from the surroundings. This was first understood by Gibbs. In an isothermal reaction working under reversible conditions, the heat absorbed from the surroundings is $TDelta S$, if this is positive then the work done will be even greater than the heat of reaction and so heat will be taken from the thermostat.



          Second question:



          The $Delta G$ you mention is actually the gradient of the free energy with extent of reaction $(partial G/partial xi)_T,p$ at constant temperature and pressure. This differential is sometimes written as $Delta G'$. The equation in general is $Delta G'=Delta G^texto+RTln(Q)$ where $Q$ is the ratio of partial pressures, for example, in a gas phase reaction. At equilibrium a plot of $G$ vs $xi$ reaches a minimum and the gradient is zero, i.e. $Delta G'=0$ then $Delta G^texto=-RTln(K_p)$ where $K_p$ is the equilibrium constant and is used instead of $Q$ at equilibrium. This reaction tells us how the position of equilibrium can be determined in terms of standard state free energies or reactants and products at 1 atm pressure.



          (The extent of reaction is zero when only reactants are present and is one when one mole of reactants have changed to product)






          share|improve this answer










          $endgroup$














          • $begingroup$
            Thank you, your answer is very nice. Can you please write something on chemical potential too?
            $endgroup$
            – adesh mishra
            5 hours ago















          3
















          $begingroup$

          Your first question:



          Before the second law was understood it used to be thought that the maximum amount of work that could be extracted from a reaction was $-Delta H$ but many experiments showed that this was not the case. It is true that, according to the first law, (the law of conservation of energy), that external work done must be equal to the loss of energy of the system, unless some heat is given to or taken from the surroundings. This was first understood by Gibbs. In an isothermal reaction working under reversible conditions, the heat absorbed from the surroundings is $TDelta S$, if this is positive then the work done will be even greater than the heat of reaction and so heat will be taken from the thermostat.



          Second question:



          The $Delta G$ you mention is actually the gradient of the free energy with extent of reaction $(partial G/partial xi)_T,p$ at constant temperature and pressure. This differential is sometimes written as $Delta G'$. The equation in general is $Delta G'=Delta G^texto+RTln(Q)$ where $Q$ is the ratio of partial pressures, for example, in a gas phase reaction. At equilibrium a plot of $G$ vs $xi$ reaches a minimum and the gradient is zero, i.e. $Delta G'=0$ then $Delta G^texto=-RTln(K_p)$ where $K_p$ is the equilibrium constant and is used instead of $Q$ at equilibrium. This reaction tells us how the position of equilibrium can be determined in terms of standard state free energies or reactants and products at 1 atm pressure.



          (The extent of reaction is zero when only reactants are present and is one when one mole of reactants have changed to product)






          share|improve this answer










          $endgroup$














          • $begingroup$
            Thank you, your answer is very nice. Can you please write something on chemical potential too?
            $endgroup$
            – adesh mishra
            5 hours ago













          3














          3










          3







          $begingroup$

          Your first question:



          Before the second law was understood it used to be thought that the maximum amount of work that could be extracted from a reaction was $-Delta H$ but many experiments showed that this was not the case. It is true that, according to the first law, (the law of conservation of energy), that external work done must be equal to the loss of energy of the system, unless some heat is given to or taken from the surroundings. This was first understood by Gibbs. In an isothermal reaction working under reversible conditions, the heat absorbed from the surroundings is $TDelta S$, if this is positive then the work done will be even greater than the heat of reaction and so heat will be taken from the thermostat.



          Second question:



          The $Delta G$ you mention is actually the gradient of the free energy with extent of reaction $(partial G/partial xi)_T,p$ at constant temperature and pressure. This differential is sometimes written as $Delta G'$. The equation in general is $Delta G'=Delta G^texto+RTln(Q)$ where $Q$ is the ratio of partial pressures, for example, in a gas phase reaction. At equilibrium a plot of $G$ vs $xi$ reaches a minimum and the gradient is zero, i.e. $Delta G'=0$ then $Delta G^texto=-RTln(K_p)$ where $K_p$ is the equilibrium constant and is used instead of $Q$ at equilibrium. This reaction tells us how the position of equilibrium can be determined in terms of standard state free energies or reactants and products at 1 atm pressure.



          (The extent of reaction is zero when only reactants are present and is one when one mole of reactants have changed to product)






          share|improve this answer










          $endgroup$



          Your first question:



          Before the second law was understood it used to be thought that the maximum amount of work that could be extracted from a reaction was $-Delta H$ but many experiments showed that this was not the case. It is true that, according to the first law, (the law of conservation of energy), that external work done must be equal to the loss of energy of the system, unless some heat is given to or taken from the surroundings. This was first understood by Gibbs. In an isothermal reaction working under reversible conditions, the heat absorbed from the surroundings is $TDelta S$, if this is positive then the work done will be even greater than the heat of reaction and so heat will be taken from the thermostat.



          Second question:



          The $Delta G$ you mention is actually the gradient of the free energy with extent of reaction $(partial G/partial xi)_T,p$ at constant temperature and pressure. This differential is sometimes written as $Delta G'$. The equation in general is $Delta G'=Delta G^texto+RTln(Q)$ where $Q$ is the ratio of partial pressures, for example, in a gas phase reaction. At equilibrium a plot of $G$ vs $xi$ reaches a minimum and the gradient is zero, i.e. $Delta G'=0$ then $Delta G^texto=-RTln(K_p)$ where $K_p$ is the equilibrium constant and is used instead of $Q$ at equilibrium. This reaction tells us how the position of equilibrium can be determined in terms of standard state free energies or reactants and products at 1 atm pressure.



          (The extent of reaction is zero when only reactants are present and is one when one mole of reactants have changed to product)







          share|improve this answer













          share|improve this answer




          share|improve this answer



          share|improve this answer










          answered 6 hours ago









          porphyrinporphyrin

          19.9k1 gold badge35 silver badges60 bronze badges




          19.9k1 gold badge35 silver badges60 bronze badges














          • $begingroup$
            Thank you, your answer is very nice. Can you please write something on chemical potential too?
            $endgroup$
            – adesh mishra
            5 hours ago
















          • $begingroup$
            Thank you, your answer is very nice. Can you please write something on chemical potential too?
            $endgroup$
            – adesh mishra
            5 hours ago















          $begingroup$
          Thank you, your answer is very nice. Can you please write something on chemical potential too?
          $endgroup$
          – adesh mishra
          5 hours ago




          $begingroup$
          Thank you, your answer is very nice. Can you please write something on chemical potential too?
          $endgroup$
          – adesh mishra
          5 hours ago


















          draft saved

          draft discarded















































          Thanks for contributing an answer to Chemistry Stack Exchange!


          • Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!

          But avoid


          • Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.

          • Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.

          Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.


          To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.




          draft saved


          draft discarded














          StackExchange.ready(
          function ()
          StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fchemistry.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f122162%2fwhat-is-the-true-meaning-of-gibbs-energy-and-chemical-potential%23new-answer', 'question_page');

          );

          Post as a guest















          Required, but never shown





















































          Required, but never shown














          Required, but never shown












          Required, but never shown







          Required, but never shown

































          Required, but never shown














          Required, but never shown












          Required, but never shown







          Required, but never shown









          Popular posts from this blog

          Canceling a color specificationRandomly assigning color to Graphics3D objects?Default color for Filling in Mathematica 9Coloring specific elements of sets with a prime modified order in an array plotHow to pick a color differing significantly from the colors already in a given color list?Detection of the text colorColor numbers based on their valueCan color schemes for use with ColorData include opacity specification?My dynamic color schemes

          Invision Community Contents History See also References External links Navigation menuProprietaryinvisioncommunity.comIPS Community ForumsIPS Community Forumsthis blog entry"License Changes, IP.Board 3.4, and the Future""Interview -- Matt Mecham of Ibforums""CEO Invision Power Board, Matt Mecham Is a Liar, Thief!"IPB License Explanation 1.3, 1.3.1, 2.0, and 2.1ArchivedSecurity Fixes, Updates And Enhancements For IPB 1.3.1Archived"New Demo Accounts - Invision Power Services"the original"New Default Skin"the original"Invision Power Board 3.0.0 and Applications Released"the original"Archived copy"the original"Perpetual licenses being done away with""Release Notes - Invision Power Services""Introducing: IPS Community Suite 4!"Invision Community Release Notes

          François Viète Contents Biography Work and thought Bibliography See also Notes Further reading External links Navigation menup. 21Google Bookspp. 75–77Google BooksDe thou (from University of Saint Andrews)ArchivedGoogle BooksGoogle BooksGoogle BooksGoogle booksGoogle Bookscc-parthenay.frL'histoire universelle (fr)Universal History (en)ArchivedAdsabs.harvard.eduPagesperso-orange.frArchive.orgChikara Sasaki. Descartes' mathematical thought p.259Google BooksGoogle BooksGoogle Bookspp. 152 and onwardGoogle BooksGoogle BooksScribd.comGoogle Books1257-7979Google BooksGoogle BooksGoogle BooksGoogle BooksGoogle BooksGoogle BooksGallica.bnf.frGoogle BooksGoogle Books"François Viète"Francois Viète: Father of Modern Algebraic NotationThe Lawyer and the GamblerAbout TarporleySite de Jean-Paul GuichardL'algèbre nouvelle"About the Harmonicon"cb120511976(data)1188044800000 0001 0913 5903n82164680ola2013766880073431702w6vt1sb70287374827140948071409480