Winning Strategy for the Magician and his ApprenticeEscape the dungeon, by deciphering the codes and navigating the rooms to find a way outThe juggling magicianThe Great Houdini's awesome card guessing trick (2)The Great Houdini's awesome card guessing trick (3)Vegas Street Magician Math TrickJack Sparrow and The quest for the missing Compass . Part 1Edward and the seven imps' GameFor the honor of HufflepuffErnie and the Disco UnicornReena and the doors. How many?

Interview not reimboursed if offer is made but not accepted

Which comes first? Multiple Imputation, Splitting into train/test, or Standardization/Normalization

What can plausibly explain many of my very long and low-tech bridges?

What risks are there when you clear your cookies instead of logging off?

Why only the fundamental frequency component is said to give useful power?

How does an ordinary object become radioactive?

Why doesn’t a normal window produce an apparent rainbow?

Was Jesus good at singing?

Can a user sell my software (MIT license) without modification?

How do I write "Show, Don't Tell" as a person with Asperger Syndrome?

Comparing and find out which feature has highest shape area in QGIS?

Is the term 'open source' a trademark?

Understanding the TeXlive release cycle: What is the meaning of a TeXlive release and is it ever 'finished'?

What can I, as a user, do about offensive reviews in App Store?

How to retract an idea already pitched to an employer?

Was the output of the C64 SID chip 8 bit sound?

What language is the software written in on the ISS?

How would a aircraft visually signal in distress?

Can an Aarakocra use a shield while flying?

Soft question: Examples where lack of mathematical rigour cause security breaches?

How to build suspense or so to establish and justify xenophobia of characters in the eyes of the reader?

Different pedals/effects for low strings/notes than high

How to officially communicate to a non-responsive colleague?

How do governments keep track of their issued currency?



Winning Strategy for the Magician and his Apprentice


Escape the dungeon, by deciphering the codes and navigating the rooms to find a way outThe juggling magicianThe Great Houdini's awesome card guessing trick (2)The Great Houdini's awesome card guessing trick (3)Vegas Street Magician Math TrickJack Sparrow and The quest for the missing Compass . Part 1Edward and the seven imps' GameFor the honor of HufflepuffErnie and the Disco UnicornReena and the doors. How many?













10












$begingroup$


There are $13$ upside-down opaque cups and $2$ balls, a magician and his apprentice and yourself. You decide under which cups to put the balls, and the objective of the magician is to find the two balls with only $4$ guesses.



The magic trick works as follows:



  1. The magician leaves the room.

  2. You put the two balls under two cups while the apprentice observes.

  3. The apprentice allows the magician to enter the room.

  4. The apprentice lifts one cup which doesn't hide a ball.

  5. The magician uses his $4$ guesses to reveal the hidden balls.

What strategy the magician and his apprentice can use such that the magician will always find the two balls?



I hope it wasn't asked before...










share|improve this question









New contributor



Ben Levin is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.






$endgroup$











  • $begingroup$
    How does the magician guess? Does he need 2 guesses to find both of the balls?
    $endgroup$
    – EKons
    8 hours ago















10












$begingroup$


There are $13$ upside-down opaque cups and $2$ balls, a magician and his apprentice and yourself. You decide under which cups to put the balls, and the objective of the magician is to find the two balls with only $4$ guesses.



The magic trick works as follows:



  1. The magician leaves the room.

  2. You put the two balls under two cups while the apprentice observes.

  3. The apprentice allows the magician to enter the room.

  4. The apprentice lifts one cup which doesn't hide a ball.

  5. The magician uses his $4$ guesses to reveal the hidden balls.

What strategy the magician and his apprentice can use such that the magician will always find the two balls?



I hope it wasn't asked before...










share|improve this question









New contributor



Ben Levin is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.






$endgroup$











  • $begingroup$
    How does the magician guess? Does he need 2 guesses to find both of the balls?
    $endgroup$
    – EKons
    8 hours ago













10












10








10


1



$begingroup$


There are $13$ upside-down opaque cups and $2$ balls, a magician and his apprentice and yourself. You decide under which cups to put the balls, and the objective of the magician is to find the two balls with only $4$ guesses.



The magic trick works as follows:



  1. The magician leaves the room.

  2. You put the two balls under two cups while the apprentice observes.

  3. The apprentice allows the magician to enter the room.

  4. The apprentice lifts one cup which doesn't hide a ball.

  5. The magician uses his $4$ guesses to reveal the hidden balls.

What strategy the magician and his apprentice can use such that the magician will always find the two balls?



I hope it wasn't asked before...










share|improve this question









New contributor



Ben Levin is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.






$endgroup$




There are $13$ upside-down opaque cups and $2$ balls, a magician and his apprentice and yourself. You decide under which cups to put the balls, and the objective of the magician is to find the two balls with only $4$ guesses.



The magic trick works as follows:



  1. The magician leaves the room.

  2. You put the two balls under two cups while the apprentice observes.

  3. The apprentice allows the magician to enter the room.

  4. The apprentice lifts one cup which doesn't hide a ball.

  5. The magician uses his $4$ guesses to reveal the hidden balls.

What strategy the magician and his apprentice can use such that the magician will always find the two balls?



I hope it wasn't asked before...







mathematics logical-deduction combinatorics






share|improve this question









New contributor



Ben Levin is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.










share|improve this question









New contributor



Ben Levin is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.








share|improve this question




share|improve this question








edited 8 hours ago









Omega Krypton

7,0832955




7,0832955






New contributor



Ben Levin is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.








asked 9 hours ago









Ben LevinBen Levin

512




512




New contributor



Ben Levin is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.




New contributor




Ben Levin is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.













  • $begingroup$
    How does the magician guess? Does he need 2 guesses to find both of the balls?
    $endgroup$
    – EKons
    8 hours ago
















  • $begingroup$
    How does the magician guess? Does he need 2 guesses to find both of the balls?
    $endgroup$
    – EKons
    8 hours ago















$begingroup$
How does the magician guess? Does he need 2 guesses to find both of the balls?
$endgroup$
– EKons
8 hours ago




$begingroup$
How does the magician guess? Does he need 2 guesses to find both of the balls?
$endgroup$
– EKons
8 hours ago










3 Answers
3






active

oldest

votes


















6












$begingroup$

Here is a simple strategy of how they could do it




Label the cups $0,1,2,ldots,12$ and the ball positions are $b_1$ and $b_2$.
The assistant picks cup $X$ such $b_1-X$ and $b_2-X$ are both in the set of residues $1,2,4,10$, modulo $13$.
Then the magician picks cups $X+1, X+2, X+4$ and $X+10$, modulo $13$
There will always be an $X$ that the assistant can pick such that magician finds both balls




Proof




Each non-zero residue modulo $13$ can be expressed as the difference between two numbers in the set $1,2,4,10$

$1 equiv 2-1, mod 13$
$2 equiv 4-2, mod 13$
$3 equiv 4-1, mod 13$
$4 equiv 1-10, mod 13$
$5 equiv 2-10, mod 13$
$6 equiv 10-4, mod 13$
$7 equiv 4-10, mod 13$
$8 equiv 10-2, mod 13$
$9 equiv 10-1, mod 13$
$10 equiv 1-4, mod 13$
$11 equiv 2-4, mod 13$
$12 equiv 1-2, mod 13$

Hence, the assistant can determine $b_2 - b_1 =x$, mod $13$, choose the equation above with $x$ on the left-hand side and pick $X$ such that $b_1$ and $b_2$ are at the appropriate relative positions on the right-hand side.







share|improve this answer











$endgroup$












  • $begingroup$
    +1 for a solution that allows the magician to pick all four balls at once, rather than adapting the choice based on previous results.
    $endgroup$
    – user3294068
    6 hours ago


















1












$begingroup$

So, first things first.



Combinations of ball locations:




$(1+12)*12/2 = 78$




There are 13 cups and four guesses.




If the magician and the apprentice agreed on a code, this can be done.




For example, if the apperentice flipped cup number 1, it means the two balls are in two cups in cup 2,3,4, and 5.



Why this works:




Each combination of 4 cups cover $3+2+1=6$ guesses




$13*6=$




$78$, covering all combinations of ball locations.




Therefore, this strategy works.






share|improve this answer









$endgroup$








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    The apprentice only has 11 choices.
    $endgroup$
    – JonMark Perry
    8 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    @JonMarkPerry Looking at it from this perspective, the concept still works. Since the apprentice rules out one cup by lifting it, there are actually only 12!/(10!*2!) = 66 possibilities remaining for the magician to have to find. Since a "code" can correspond to 6 arrangements, and 11*6 = 66, this still works.
    $endgroup$
    – Michael Moschella
    7 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    @JMP hexomino's answer is the solution to your question. we have the same concept, and his or her answer is the extension of mine, proving my point
    $endgroup$
    – Omega Krypton
    7 hours ago


















1












$begingroup$

Expanding on Omega Krypton's solution:




I decided to form my own "code" assigning 4 possible cups to each potential lifted cup, and you can indeed make a code that will always result in a correct guess.




The first number represents the apprentice's cup, the other 4 are the magician's guesses.




1 - 2,5,8,11

2 - 1,5,6,7

3 - 1,8,9,10

4 - 1,11,12,13

5 - 1,2,3,4

6 - 2,7,10,13

7 - 2,6,9,12

8 - 3,5,9,13

9 - 3,6,10,11

10 - 3,7,8,12

11 - 4,5,10,12

12 - 4,6,8,13

13 - 4,7,9,11




This is a rather ugly and hard to remember combination, though it just exists as a proof of concept, I just went through a greedy algorithm to assign 4 cups to each number such that you never have two overlapping. I'm sure there is a more elegant way to arrange them.






share|improve this answer










New contributor



Michael Moschella is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.





$endgroup$













    Your Answer








    StackExchange.ready(function()
    var channelOptions =
    tags: "".split(" "),
    id: "559"
    ;
    initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);

    StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function()
    // Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
    if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled)
    StackExchange.using("snippets", function()
    createEditor();
    );

    else
    createEditor();

    );

    function createEditor()
    StackExchange.prepareEditor(
    heartbeatType: 'answer',
    autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
    convertImagesToLinks: false,
    noModals: true,
    showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
    reputationToPostImages: null,
    bindNavPrevention: true,
    postfix: "",
    imageUploader:
    brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
    contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
    allowUrls: true
    ,
    noCode: true, onDemand: true,
    discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
    ,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
    );



    );






    Ben Levin is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.









    draft saved

    draft discarded


















    StackExchange.ready(
    function ()
    StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fpuzzling.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f84649%2fwinning-strategy-for-the-magician-and-his-apprentice%23new-answer', 'question_page');

    );

    Post as a guest















    Required, but never shown

























    3 Answers
    3






    active

    oldest

    votes








    3 Answers
    3






    active

    oldest

    votes









    active

    oldest

    votes






    active

    oldest

    votes









    6












    $begingroup$

    Here is a simple strategy of how they could do it




    Label the cups $0,1,2,ldots,12$ and the ball positions are $b_1$ and $b_2$.
    The assistant picks cup $X$ such $b_1-X$ and $b_2-X$ are both in the set of residues $1,2,4,10$, modulo $13$.
    Then the magician picks cups $X+1, X+2, X+4$ and $X+10$, modulo $13$
    There will always be an $X$ that the assistant can pick such that magician finds both balls




    Proof




    Each non-zero residue modulo $13$ can be expressed as the difference between two numbers in the set $1,2,4,10$

    $1 equiv 2-1, mod 13$
    $2 equiv 4-2, mod 13$
    $3 equiv 4-1, mod 13$
    $4 equiv 1-10, mod 13$
    $5 equiv 2-10, mod 13$
    $6 equiv 10-4, mod 13$
    $7 equiv 4-10, mod 13$
    $8 equiv 10-2, mod 13$
    $9 equiv 10-1, mod 13$
    $10 equiv 1-4, mod 13$
    $11 equiv 2-4, mod 13$
    $12 equiv 1-2, mod 13$

    Hence, the assistant can determine $b_2 - b_1 =x$, mod $13$, choose the equation above with $x$ on the left-hand side and pick $X$ such that $b_1$ and $b_2$ are at the appropriate relative positions on the right-hand side.







    share|improve this answer











    $endgroup$












    • $begingroup$
      +1 for a solution that allows the magician to pick all four balls at once, rather than adapting the choice based on previous results.
      $endgroup$
      – user3294068
      6 hours ago















    6












    $begingroup$

    Here is a simple strategy of how they could do it




    Label the cups $0,1,2,ldots,12$ and the ball positions are $b_1$ and $b_2$.
    The assistant picks cup $X$ such $b_1-X$ and $b_2-X$ are both in the set of residues $1,2,4,10$, modulo $13$.
    Then the magician picks cups $X+1, X+2, X+4$ and $X+10$, modulo $13$
    There will always be an $X$ that the assistant can pick such that magician finds both balls




    Proof




    Each non-zero residue modulo $13$ can be expressed as the difference between two numbers in the set $1,2,4,10$

    $1 equiv 2-1, mod 13$
    $2 equiv 4-2, mod 13$
    $3 equiv 4-1, mod 13$
    $4 equiv 1-10, mod 13$
    $5 equiv 2-10, mod 13$
    $6 equiv 10-4, mod 13$
    $7 equiv 4-10, mod 13$
    $8 equiv 10-2, mod 13$
    $9 equiv 10-1, mod 13$
    $10 equiv 1-4, mod 13$
    $11 equiv 2-4, mod 13$
    $12 equiv 1-2, mod 13$

    Hence, the assistant can determine $b_2 - b_1 =x$, mod $13$, choose the equation above with $x$ on the left-hand side and pick $X$ such that $b_1$ and $b_2$ are at the appropriate relative positions on the right-hand side.







    share|improve this answer











    $endgroup$












    • $begingroup$
      +1 for a solution that allows the magician to pick all four balls at once, rather than adapting the choice based on previous results.
      $endgroup$
      – user3294068
      6 hours ago













    6












    6








    6





    $begingroup$

    Here is a simple strategy of how they could do it




    Label the cups $0,1,2,ldots,12$ and the ball positions are $b_1$ and $b_2$.
    The assistant picks cup $X$ such $b_1-X$ and $b_2-X$ are both in the set of residues $1,2,4,10$, modulo $13$.
    Then the magician picks cups $X+1, X+2, X+4$ and $X+10$, modulo $13$
    There will always be an $X$ that the assistant can pick such that magician finds both balls




    Proof




    Each non-zero residue modulo $13$ can be expressed as the difference between two numbers in the set $1,2,4,10$

    $1 equiv 2-1, mod 13$
    $2 equiv 4-2, mod 13$
    $3 equiv 4-1, mod 13$
    $4 equiv 1-10, mod 13$
    $5 equiv 2-10, mod 13$
    $6 equiv 10-4, mod 13$
    $7 equiv 4-10, mod 13$
    $8 equiv 10-2, mod 13$
    $9 equiv 10-1, mod 13$
    $10 equiv 1-4, mod 13$
    $11 equiv 2-4, mod 13$
    $12 equiv 1-2, mod 13$

    Hence, the assistant can determine $b_2 - b_1 =x$, mod $13$, choose the equation above with $x$ on the left-hand side and pick $X$ such that $b_1$ and $b_2$ are at the appropriate relative positions on the right-hand side.







    share|improve this answer











    $endgroup$



    Here is a simple strategy of how they could do it




    Label the cups $0,1,2,ldots,12$ and the ball positions are $b_1$ and $b_2$.
    The assistant picks cup $X$ such $b_1-X$ and $b_2-X$ are both in the set of residues $1,2,4,10$, modulo $13$.
    Then the magician picks cups $X+1, X+2, X+4$ and $X+10$, modulo $13$
    There will always be an $X$ that the assistant can pick such that magician finds both balls




    Proof




    Each non-zero residue modulo $13$ can be expressed as the difference between two numbers in the set $1,2,4,10$

    $1 equiv 2-1, mod 13$
    $2 equiv 4-2, mod 13$
    $3 equiv 4-1, mod 13$
    $4 equiv 1-10, mod 13$
    $5 equiv 2-10, mod 13$
    $6 equiv 10-4, mod 13$
    $7 equiv 4-10, mod 13$
    $8 equiv 10-2, mod 13$
    $9 equiv 10-1, mod 13$
    $10 equiv 1-4, mod 13$
    $11 equiv 2-4, mod 13$
    $12 equiv 1-2, mod 13$

    Hence, the assistant can determine $b_2 - b_1 =x$, mod $13$, choose the equation above with $x$ on the left-hand side and pick $X$ such that $b_1$ and $b_2$ are at the appropriate relative positions on the right-hand side.








    share|improve this answer














    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer








    edited 8 hours ago

























    answered 8 hours ago









    hexominohexomino

    51.8k4152245




    51.8k4152245











    • $begingroup$
      +1 for a solution that allows the magician to pick all four balls at once, rather than adapting the choice based on previous results.
      $endgroup$
      – user3294068
      6 hours ago
















    • $begingroup$
      +1 for a solution that allows the magician to pick all four balls at once, rather than adapting the choice based on previous results.
      $endgroup$
      – user3294068
      6 hours ago















    $begingroup$
    +1 for a solution that allows the magician to pick all four balls at once, rather than adapting the choice based on previous results.
    $endgroup$
    – user3294068
    6 hours ago




    $begingroup$
    +1 for a solution that allows the magician to pick all four balls at once, rather than adapting the choice based on previous results.
    $endgroup$
    – user3294068
    6 hours ago











    1












    $begingroup$

    So, first things first.



    Combinations of ball locations:




    $(1+12)*12/2 = 78$




    There are 13 cups and four guesses.




    If the magician and the apprentice agreed on a code, this can be done.




    For example, if the apperentice flipped cup number 1, it means the two balls are in two cups in cup 2,3,4, and 5.



    Why this works:




    Each combination of 4 cups cover $3+2+1=6$ guesses




    $13*6=$




    $78$, covering all combinations of ball locations.




    Therefore, this strategy works.






    share|improve this answer









    $endgroup$








    • 1




      $begingroup$
      The apprentice only has 11 choices.
      $endgroup$
      – JonMark Perry
      8 hours ago










    • $begingroup$
      @JonMarkPerry Looking at it from this perspective, the concept still works. Since the apprentice rules out one cup by lifting it, there are actually only 12!/(10!*2!) = 66 possibilities remaining for the magician to have to find. Since a "code" can correspond to 6 arrangements, and 11*6 = 66, this still works.
      $endgroup$
      – Michael Moschella
      7 hours ago










    • $begingroup$
      @JMP hexomino's answer is the solution to your question. we have the same concept, and his or her answer is the extension of mine, proving my point
      $endgroup$
      – Omega Krypton
      7 hours ago















    1












    $begingroup$

    So, first things first.



    Combinations of ball locations:




    $(1+12)*12/2 = 78$




    There are 13 cups and four guesses.




    If the magician and the apprentice agreed on a code, this can be done.




    For example, if the apperentice flipped cup number 1, it means the two balls are in two cups in cup 2,3,4, and 5.



    Why this works:




    Each combination of 4 cups cover $3+2+1=6$ guesses




    $13*6=$




    $78$, covering all combinations of ball locations.




    Therefore, this strategy works.






    share|improve this answer









    $endgroup$








    • 1




      $begingroup$
      The apprentice only has 11 choices.
      $endgroup$
      – JonMark Perry
      8 hours ago










    • $begingroup$
      @JonMarkPerry Looking at it from this perspective, the concept still works. Since the apprentice rules out one cup by lifting it, there are actually only 12!/(10!*2!) = 66 possibilities remaining for the magician to have to find. Since a "code" can correspond to 6 arrangements, and 11*6 = 66, this still works.
      $endgroup$
      – Michael Moschella
      7 hours ago










    • $begingroup$
      @JMP hexomino's answer is the solution to your question. we have the same concept, and his or her answer is the extension of mine, proving my point
      $endgroup$
      – Omega Krypton
      7 hours ago













    1












    1








    1





    $begingroup$

    So, first things first.



    Combinations of ball locations:




    $(1+12)*12/2 = 78$




    There are 13 cups and four guesses.




    If the magician and the apprentice agreed on a code, this can be done.




    For example, if the apperentice flipped cup number 1, it means the two balls are in two cups in cup 2,3,4, and 5.



    Why this works:




    Each combination of 4 cups cover $3+2+1=6$ guesses




    $13*6=$




    $78$, covering all combinations of ball locations.




    Therefore, this strategy works.






    share|improve this answer









    $endgroup$



    So, first things first.



    Combinations of ball locations:




    $(1+12)*12/2 = 78$




    There are 13 cups and four guesses.




    If the magician and the apprentice agreed on a code, this can be done.




    For example, if the apperentice flipped cup number 1, it means the two balls are in two cups in cup 2,3,4, and 5.



    Why this works:




    Each combination of 4 cups cover $3+2+1=6$ guesses




    $13*6=$




    $78$, covering all combinations of ball locations.




    Therefore, this strategy works.







    share|improve this answer












    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer










    answered 8 hours ago









    Omega KryptonOmega Krypton

    7,0832955




    7,0832955







    • 1




      $begingroup$
      The apprentice only has 11 choices.
      $endgroup$
      – JonMark Perry
      8 hours ago










    • $begingroup$
      @JonMarkPerry Looking at it from this perspective, the concept still works. Since the apprentice rules out one cup by lifting it, there are actually only 12!/(10!*2!) = 66 possibilities remaining for the magician to have to find. Since a "code" can correspond to 6 arrangements, and 11*6 = 66, this still works.
      $endgroup$
      – Michael Moschella
      7 hours ago










    • $begingroup$
      @JMP hexomino's answer is the solution to your question. we have the same concept, and his or her answer is the extension of mine, proving my point
      $endgroup$
      – Omega Krypton
      7 hours ago












    • 1




      $begingroup$
      The apprentice only has 11 choices.
      $endgroup$
      – JonMark Perry
      8 hours ago










    • $begingroup$
      @JonMarkPerry Looking at it from this perspective, the concept still works. Since the apprentice rules out one cup by lifting it, there are actually only 12!/(10!*2!) = 66 possibilities remaining for the magician to have to find. Since a "code" can correspond to 6 arrangements, and 11*6 = 66, this still works.
      $endgroup$
      – Michael Moschella
      7 hours ago










    • $begingroup$
      @JMP hexomino's answer is the solution to your question. we have the same concept, and his or her answer is the extension of mine, proving my point
      $endgroup$
      – Omega Krypton
      7 hours ago







    1




    1




    $begingroup$
    The apprentice only has 11 choices.
    $endgroup$
    – JonMark Perry
    8 hours ago




    $begingroup$
    The apprentice only has 11 choices.
    $endgroup$
    – JonMark Perry
    8 hours ago












    $begingroup$
    @JonMarkPerry Looking at it from this perspective, the concept still works. Since the apprentice rules out one cup by lifting it, there are actually only 12!/(10!*2!) = 66 possibilities remaining for the magician to have to find. Since a "code" can correspond to 6 arrangements, and 11*6 = 66, this still works.
    $endgroup$
    – Michael Moschella
    7 hours ago




    $begingroup$
    @JonMarkPerry Looking at it from this perspective, the concept still works. Since the apprentice rules out one cup by lifting it, there are actually only 12!/(10!*2!) = 66 possibilities remaining for the magician to have to find. Since a "code" can correspond to 6 arrangements, and 11*6 = 66, this still works.
    $endgroup$
    – Michael Moschella
    7 hours ago












    $begingroup$
    @JMP hexomino's answer is the solution to your question. we have the same concept, and his or her answer is the extension of mine, proving my point
    $endgroup$
    – Omega Krypton
    7 hours ago




    $begingroup$
    @JMP hexomino's answer is the solution to your question. we have the same concept, and his or her answer is the extension of mine, proving my point
    $endgroup$
    – Omega Krypton
    7 hours ago











    1












    $begingroup$

    Expanding on Omega Krypton's solution:




    I decided to form my own "code" assigning 4 possible cups to each potential lifted cup, and you can indeed make a code that will always result in a correct guess.




    The first number represents the apprentice's cup, the other 4 are the magician's guesses.




    1 - 2,5,8,11

    2 - 1,5,6,7

    3 - 1,8,9,10

    4 - 1,11,12,13

    5 - 1,2,3,4

    6 - 2,7,10,13

    7 - 2,6,9,12

    8 - 3,5,9,13

    9 - 3,6,10,11

    10 - 3,7,8,12

    11 - 4,5,10,12

    12 - 4,6,8,13

    13 - 4,7,9,11




    This is a rather ugly and hard to remember combination, though it just exists as a proof of concept, I just went through a greedy algorithm to assign 4 cups to each number such that you never have two overlapping. I'm sure there is a more elegant way to arrange them.






    share|improve this answer










    New contributor



    Michael Moschella is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.





    $endgroup$

















      1












      $begingroup$

      Expanding on Omega Krypton's solution:




      I decided to form my own "code" assigning 4 possible cups to each potential lifted cup, and you can indeed make a code that will always result in a correct guess.




      The first number represents the apprentice's cup, the other 4 are the magician's guesses.




      1 - 2,5,8,11

      2 - 1,5,6,7

      3 - 1,8,9,10

      4 - 1,11,12,13

      5 - 1,2,3,4

      6 - 2,7,10,13

      7 - 2,6,9,12

      8 - 3,5,9,13

      9 - 3,6,10,11

      10 - 3,7,8,12

      11 - 4,5,10,12

      12 - 4,6,8,13

      13 - 4,7,9,11




      This is a rather ugly and hard to remember combination, though it just exists as a proof of concept, I just went through a greedy algorithm to assign 4 cups to each number such that you never have two overlapping. I'm sure there is a more elegant way to arrange them.






      share|improve this answer










      New contributor



      Michael Moschella is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.





      $endgroup$















        1












        1








        1





        $begingroup$

        Expanding on Omega Krypton's solution:




        I decided to form my own "code" assigning 4 possible cups to each potential lifted cup, and you can indeed make a code that will always result in a correct guess.




        The first number represents the apprentice's cup, the other 4 are the magician's guesses.




        1 - 2,5,8,11

        2 - 1,5,6,7

        3 - 1,8,9,10

        4 - 1,11,12,13

        5 - 1,2,3,4

        6 - 2,7,10,13

        7 - 2,6,9,12

        8 - 3,5,9,13

        9 - 3,6,10,11

        10 - 3,7,8,12

        11 - 4,5,10,12

        12 - 4,6,8,13

        13 - 4,7,9,11




        This is a rather ugly and hard to remember combination, though it just exists as a proof of concept, I just went through a greedy algorithm to assign 4 cups to each number such that you never have two overlapping. I'm sure there is a more elegant way to arrange them.






        share|improve this answer










        New contributor



        Michael Moschella is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.





        $endgroup$



        Expanding on Omega Krypton's solution:




        I decided to form my own "code" assigning 4 possible cups to each potential lifted cup, and you can indeed make a code that will always result in a correct guess.




        The first number represents the apprentice's cup, the other 4 are the magician's guesses.




        1 - 2,5,8,11

        2 - 1,5,6,7

        3 - 1,8,9,10

        4 - 1,11,12,13

        5 - 1,2,3,4

        6 - 2,7,10,13

        7 - 2,6,9,12

        8 - 3,5,9,13

        9 - 3,6,10,11

        10 - 3,7,8,12

        11 - 4,5,10,12

        12 - 4,6,8,13

        13 - 4,7,9,11




        This is a rather ugly and hard to remember combination, though it just exists as a proof of concept, I just went through a greedy algorithm to assign 4 cups to each number such that you never have two overlapping. I'm sure there is a more elegant way to arrange them.







        share|improve this answer










        New contributor



        Michael Moschella is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.








        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer








        edited 7 hours ago





















        New contributor



        Michael Moschella is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.








        answered 7 hours ago









        Michael MoschellaMichael Moschella

        613




        613




        New contributor



        Michael Moschella is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.




        New contributor




        Michael Moschella is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.






















            Ben Levin is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.









            draft saved

            draft discarded


















            Ben Levin is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.












            Ben Levin is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.











            Ben Levin is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.














            Thanks for contributing an answer to Puzzling Stack Exchange!


            • Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!

            But avoid


            • Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.

            • Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.

            Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.


            To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.




            draft saved


            draft discarded














            StackExchange.ready(
            function ()
            StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fpuzzling.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f84649%2fwinning-strategy-for-the-magician-and-his-apprentice%23new-answer', 'question_page');

            );

            Post as a guest















            Required, but never shown





















































            Required, but never shown














            Required, but never shown












            Required, but never shown







            Required, but never shown

































            Required, but never shown














            Required, but never shown












            Required, but never shown







            Required, but never shown







            Popular posts from this blog

            Invision Community Contents History See also References External links Navigation menuProprietaryinvisioncommunity.comIPS Community ForumsIPS Community Forumsthis blog entry"License Changes, IP.Board 3.4, and the Future""Interview -- Matt Mecham of Ibforums""CEO Invision Power Board, Matt Mecham Is a Liar, Thief!"IPB License Explanation 1.3, 1.3.1, 2.0, and 2.1ArchivedSecurity Fixes, Updates And Enhancements For IPB 1.3.1Archived"New Demo Accounts - Invision Power Services"the original"New Default Skin"the original"Invision Power Board 3.0.0 and Applications Released"the original"Archived copy"the original"Perpetual licenses being done away with""Release Notes - Invision Power Services""Introducing: IPS Community Suite 4!"Invision Community Release Notes

            Canceling a color specificationRandomly assigning color to Graphics3D objects?Default color for Filling in Mathematica 9Coloring specific elements of sets with a prime modified order in an array plotHow to pick a color differing significantly from the colors already in a given color list?Detection of the text colorColor numbers based on their valueCan color schemes for use with ColorData include opacity specification?My dynamic color schemes

            Tom Holland Mục lục Đầu đời và giáo dục | Sự nghiệp | Cuộc sống cá nhân | Phim tham gia | Giải thưởng và đề cử | Chú thích | Liên kết ngoài | Trình đơn chuyển hướngProfile“Person Details for Thomas Stanley Holland, "England and Wales Birth Registration Index, 1837-2008" — FamilySearch.org”"Meet Tom Holland... the 16-year-old star of The Impossible""Schoolboy actor Tom Holland finds himself in Oscar contention for role in tsunami drama"“Naomi Watts on the Prince William and Harry's reaction to her film about the late Princess Diana”lưu trữ"Holland and Pflueger Are West End's Two New 'Billy Elliots'""I'm so envious of my son, the movie star! British writer Dominic Holland's spent 20 years trying to crack Hollywood - but he's been beaten to it by a very unlikely rival"“Richard and Margaret Povey of Jersey, Channel Islands, UK: Information about Thomas Stanley Holland”"Tom Holland to play Billy Elliot""New Billy Elliot leaving the garage"Billy Elliot the Musical - Tom Holland - Billy"A Tale of four Billys: Tom Holland""The Feel Good Factor""Thames Christian College schoolboys join Myleene Klass for The Feelgood Factor""Government launches £600,000 arts bursaries pilot""BILLY's Chapman, Holland, Gardner & Jackson-Keen Visit Prime Minister""Elton John 'blown away' by Billy Elliot fifth birthday" (video with John's interview and fragments of Holland's performance)"First News interviews Arrietty's Tom Holland"“33rd Critics' Circle Film Awards winners”“National Board of Review Current Awards”Bản gốc"Ron Howard Whaling Tale 'In The Heart Of The Sea' Casts Tom Holland"“'Spider-Man' Finds Tom Holland to Star as New Web-Slinger”lưu trữ“Captain America: Civil War (2016)”“Film Review: ‘Captain America: Civil War’”lưu trữ“‘Captain America: Civil War’ review: Choose your own avenger”lưu trữ“The Lost City of Z reviews”“Sony Pictures and Marvel Studios Find Their 'Spider-Man' Star and Director”“‘Mary Magdalene’, ‘Current War’ & ‘Wind River’ Get 2017 Release Dates From Weinstein”“Lionsgate Unleashing Daisy Ridley & Tom Holland Starrer ‘Chaos Walking’ In Cannes”“PTA's 'Master' Leads Chicago Film Critics Nominations, UPDATED: Houston and Indiana Critics Nominations”“Nominaciones Goya 2013 Telecinco Cinema – ENG”“Jameson Empire Film Awards: Martin Freeman wins best actor for performance in The Hobbit”“34th Annual Young Artist Awards”Bản gốc“Teen Choice Awards 2016—Captain America: Civil War Leads Second Wave of Nominations”“BAFTA Film Award Nominations: ‘La La Land’ Leads Race”“Saturn Awards Nominations 2017: 'Rogue One,' 'Walking Dead' Lead”Tom HollandTom HollandTom HollandTom Hollandmedia.gettyimages.comWorldCat Identities300279794no20130442900000 0004 0355 42791085670554170004732cb16706349t(data)XX5557367