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When was “Fredo” an insult to Italian-Americans?
The origin of the derogatory usage of GuidoIs it customary to call the former President George W. Bush “W.”, and Mrs. Bush “Bar”, in public?We might have to do some “fiddling”What's the etymology of “tit” (the insult)?centre vs. center among AmericansWhat does this insult mean?Trump's use of “our” when “the” would do
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Recently in the news there's been some kerfuffle about a verbal exchange between CNN anchorman, Chris Cuomo, and a person who called him “Fredo”. In the cell-phone video, the man claims
I thought that was who you were
Cuomo responds that his name is Chris and he works for CNN. He then explains why he is offended by the term “Fredo" and why it is insulting for Italian-Americans.
Only punk-ass bitches from the right call me Fredo.
Fredo is from The Godfather. He was a weak brother. And they're using it as an Italian aspersion. […]
[“Fredo“] is like the n-word for us.
During the argument, Cuomo's anger escalates and in the ensuing expletive-ridden tirade, he threatens to use physical violence. The man repeatedly but calmly (probably seeking to bait Cuomo) interjects
I thought that was your name
Many reports clarify that "Fredo" does not carry the same cultural baggage or level of hostility as the n-word. Italians were neither enslaved nor victims of a systematic genocide in the US or in Europe. I am unaware if this term is considered a slur in the UK, I suspect it isn't, it seems to be exclusively American English. Hannah Gold for The Cut writes
…the term “Fredo” has become a cultural short-hand for “incompetent, cowardly, large adult son.”
In fact, online it has been suggested that Chris Cuomo may have an inferiority complex. His elder brother, Andrew Cuomo, has been governor of New York since 2011. And their father, Mario Cuomo, served eleven years as governor of New York.
Unfortunately, the President of the USA decided to stoke things further by tweeting the following
I thought Chris was Fredo also. The Truth hurts.
Totally lost it! Low ratings at CNN
In another Tweet, he added
Would Chris Cuomo be given a Red Flag for his recent rant? Filthy language and a total loss of control. He shouldn't be allowed to have any weapon. He's nuts!
- What did the POTUS mean by saying he thought Chris was Fredo also?
Did he think the CNN news anchor was called Fredo? Was he insinuating that Cuomo was weak and less intelligent than his elder brother? Was the President indirectly insulting Italian Americans? Was he insinuating that the family Cuomo had Mafia connections?
- When did calling someone “Fredo” become an insult? Is it considered racist in the US?
etymology american-english pejorative-language trumpism
|
show 10 more comments
Recently in the news there's been some kerfuffle about a verbal exchange between CNN anchorman, Chris Cuomo, and a person who called him “Fredo”. In the cell-phone video, the man claims
I thought that was who you were
Cuomo responds that his name is Chris and he works for CNN. He then explains why he is offended by the term “Fredo" and why it is insulting for Italian-Americans.
Only punk-ass bitches from the right call me Fredo.
Fredo is from The Godfather. He was a weak brother. And they're using it as an Italian aspersion. […]
[“Fredo“] is like the n-word for us.
During the argument, Cuomo's anger escalates and in the ensuing expletive-ridden tirade, he threatens to use physical violence. The man repeatedly but calmly (probably seeking to bait Cuomo) interjects
I thought that was your name
Many reports clarify that "Fredo" does not carry the same cultural baggage or level of hostility as the n-word. Italians were neither enslaved nor victims of a systematic genocide in the US or in Europe. I am unaware if this term is considered a slur in the UK, I suspect it isn't, it seems to be exclusively American English. Hannah Gold for The Cut writes
…the term “Fredo” has become a cultural short-hand for “incompetent, cowardly, large adult son.”
In fact, online it has been suggested that Chris Cuomo may have an inferiority complex. His elder brother, Andrew Cuomo, has been governor of New York since 2011. And their father, Mario Cuomo, served eleven years as governor of New York.
Unfortunately, the President of the USA decided to stoke things further by tweeting the following
I thought Chris was Fredo also. The Truth hurts.
Totally lost it! Low ratings at CNN
In another Tweet, he added
Would Chris Cuomo be given a Red Flag for his recent rant? Filthy language and a total loss of control. He shouldn't be allowed to have any weapon. He's nuts!
- What did the POTUS mean by saying he thought Chris was Fredo also?
Did he think the CNN news anchor was called Fredo? Was he insinuating that Cuomo was weak and less intelligent than his elder brother? Was the President indirectly insulting Italian Americans? Was he insinuating that the family Cuomo had Mafia connections?
- When did calling someone “Fredo” become an insult? Is it considered racist in the US?
etymology american-english pejorative-language trumpism
2
I always heard "Guido" that way, but not "Fredo". Interesting.
– Cascabel
9 hours ago
3
@Cascabel Same here. Guido I’m familiar with; Fredo is new to me as anything but an actual short form of Alfredo.
– Janus Bahs Jacquet
9 hours ago
You may want to consider removing the phrase, "... (probably seeking to bait Cuomo) … ". It's not relevant to your post and represents pure speculation.
– Michael_B
9 hours ago
2
@Michael_B My post is perfectly unbiased. I tried to be as impartial as possible, that also includes a plausible explanation as to why Cuomo continued to heavily swear and threaten the man with violence. Should I leave out the expletives, and the reference to using physical violence also?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
@Michael_B The phrase is relevant as it establishes possible reasons for assessing the relative disparagement of the term. It may be partially begging the question, but it is very relevant. As to speculation, it may be so but disparagement (and other word meaning) is based on assessing hidden mental states.
– Mitch
8 hours ago
|
show 10 more comments
Recently in the news there's been some kerfuffle about a verbal exchange between CNN anchorman, Chris Cuomo, and a person who called him “Fredo”. In the cell-phone video, the man claims
I thought that was who you were
Cuomo responds that his name is Chris and he works for CNN. He then explains why he is offended by the term “Fredo" and why it is insulting for Italian-Americans.
Only punk-ass bitches from the right call me Fredo.
Fredo is from The Godfather. He was a weak brother. And they're using it as an Italian aspersion. […]
[“Fredo“] is like the n-word for us.
During the argument, Cuomo's anger escalates and in the ensuing expletive-ridden tirade, he threatens to use physical violence. The man repeatedly but calmly (probably seeking to bait Cuomo) interjects
I thought that was your name
Many reports clarify that "Fredo" does not carry the same cultural baggage or level of hostility as the n-word. Italians were neither enslaved nor victims of a systematic genocide in the US or in Europe. I am unaware if this term is considered a slur in the UK, I suspect it isn't, it seems to be exclusively American English. Hannah Gold for The Cut writes
…the term “Fredo” has become a cultural short-hand for “incompetent, cowardly, large adult son.”
In fact, online it has been suggested that Chris Cuomo may have an inferiority complex. His elder brother, Andrew Cuomo, has been governor of New York since 2011. And their father, Mario Cuomo, served eleven years as governor of New York.
Unfortunately, the President of the USA decided to stoke things further by tweeting the following
I thought Chris was Fredo also. The Truth hurts.
Totally lost it! Low ratings at CNN
In another Tweet, he added
Would Chris Cuomo be given a Red Flag for his recent rant? Filthy language and a total loss of control. He shouldn't be allowed to have any weapon. He's nuts!
- What did the POTUS mean by saying he thought Chris was Fredo also?
Did he think the CNN news anchor was called Fredo? Was he insinuating that Cuomo was weak and less intelligent than his elder brother? Was the President indirectly insulting Italian Americans? Was he insinuating that the family Cuomo had Mafia connections?
- When did calling someone “Fredo” become an insult? Is it considered racist in the US?
etymology american-english pejorative-language trumpism
Recently in the news there's been some kerfuffle about a verbal exchange between CNN anchorman, Chris Cuomo, and a person who called him “Fredo”. In the cell-phone video, the man claims
I thought that was who you were
Cuomo responds that his name is Chris and he works for CNN. He then explains why he is offended by the term “Fredo" and why it is insulting for Italian-Americans.
Only punk-ass bitches from the right call me Fredo.
Fredo is from The Godfather. He was a weak brother. And they're using it as an Italian aspersion. […]
[“Fredo“] is like the n-word for us.
During the argument, Cuomo's anger escalates and in the ensuing expletive-ridden tirade, he threatens to use physical violence. The man repeatedly but calmly (probably seeking to bait Cuomo) interjects
I thought that was your name
Many reports clarify that "Fredo" does not carry the same cultural baggage or level of hostility as the n-word. Italians were neither enslaved nor victims of a systematic genocide in the US or in Europe. I am unaware if this term is considered a slur in the UK, I suspect it isn't, it seems to be exclusively American English. Hannah Gold for The Cut writes
…the term “Fredo” has become a cultural short-hand for “incompetent, cowardly, large adult son.”
In fact, online it has been suggested that Chris Cuomo may have an inferiority complex. His elder brother, Andrew Cuomo, has been governor of New York since 2011. And their father, Mario Cuomo, served eleven years as governor of New York.
Unfortunately, the President of the USA decided to stoke things further by tweeting the following
I thought Chris was Fredo also. The Truth hurts.
Totally lost it! Low ratings at CNN
In another Tweet, he added
Would Chris Cuomo be given a Red Flag for his recent rant? Filthy language and a total loss of control. He shouldn't be allowed to have any weapon. He's nuts!
- What did the POTUS mean by saying he thought Chris was Fredo also?
Did he think the CNN news anchor was called Fredo? Was he insinuating that Cuomo was weak and less intelligent than his elder brother? Was the President indirectly insulting Italian Americans? Was he insinuating that the family Cuomo had Mafia connections?
- When did calling someone “Fredo” become an insult? Is it considered racist in the US?
etymology american-english pejorative-language trumpism
etymology american-english pejorative-language trumpism
edited 9 hours ago
Mari-Lou A
asked 9 hours ago
Mari-Lou AMari-Lou A
64k58 gold badges239 silver badges487 bronze badges
64k58 gold badges239 silver badges487 bronze badges
2
I always heard "Guido" that way, but not "Fredo". Interesting.
– Cascabel
9 hours ago
3
@Cascabel Same here. Guido I’m familiar with; Fredo is new to me as anything but an actual short form of Alfredo.
– Janus Bahs Jacquet
9 hours ago
You may want to consider removing the phrase, "... (probably seeking to bait Cuomo) … ". It's not relevant to your post and represents pure speculation.
– Michael_B
9 hours ago
2
@Michael_B My post is perfectly unbiased. I tried to be as impartial as possible, that also includes a plausible explanation as to why Cuomo continued to heavily swear and threaten the man with violence. Should I leave out the expletives, and the reference to using physical violence also?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
@Michael_B The phrase is relevant as it establishes possible reasons for assessing the relative disparagement of the term. It may be partially begging the question, but it is very relevant. As to speculation, it may be so but disparagement (and other word meaning) is based on assessing hidden mental states.
– Mitch
8 hours ago
|
show 10 more comments
2
I always heard "Guido" that way, but not "Fredo". Interesting.
– Cascabel
9 hours ago
3
@Cascabel Same here. Guido I’m familiar with; Fredo is new to me as anything but an actual short form of Alfredo.
– Janus Bahs Jacquet
9 hours ago
You may want to consider removing the phrase, "... (probably seeking to bait Cuomo) … ". It's not relevant to your post and represents pure speculation.
– Michael_B
9 hours ago
2
@Michael_B My post is perfectly unbiased. I tried to be as impartial as possible, that also includes a plausible explanation as to why Cuomo continued to heavily swear and threaten the man with violence. Should I leave out the expletives, and the reference to using physical violence also?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
@Michael_B The phrase is relevant as it establishes possible reasons for assessing the relative disparagement of the term. It may be partially begging the question, but it is very relevant. As to speculation, it may be so but disparagement (and other word meaning) is based on assessing hidden mental states.
– Mitch
8 hours ago
2
2
I always heard "Guido" that way, but not "Fredo". Interesting.
– Cascabel
9 hours ago
I always heard "Guido" that way, but not "Fredo". Interesting.
– Cascabel
9 hours ago
3
3
@Cascabel Same here. Guido I’m familiar with; Fredo is new to me as anything but an actual short form of Alfredo.
– Janus Bahs Jacquet
9 hours ago
@Cascabel Same here. Guido I’m familiar with; Fredo is new to me as anything but an actual short form of Alfredo.
– Janus Bahs Jacquet
9 hours ago
You may want to consider removing the phrase, "... (probably seeking to bait Cuomo) … ". It's not relevant to your post and represents pure speculation.
– Michael_B
9 hours ago
You may want to consider removing the phrase, "... (probably seeking to bait Cuomo) … ". It's not relevant to your post and represents pure speculation.
– Michael_B
9 hours ago
2
2
@Michael_B My post is perfectly unbiased. I tried to be as impartial as possible, that also includes a plausible explanation as to why Cuomo continued to heavily swear and threaten the man with violence. Should I leave out the expletives, and the reference to using physical violence also?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
@Michael_B My post is perfectly unbiased. I tried to be as impartial as possible, that also includes a plausible explanation as to why Cuomo continued to heavily swear and threaten the man with violence. Should I leave out the expletives, and the reference to using physical violence also?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
1
@Michael_B The phrase is relevant as it establishes possible reasons for assessing the relative disparagement of the term. It may be partially begging the question, but it is very relevant. As to speculation, it may be so but disparagement (and other word meaning) is based on assessing hidden mental states.
– Mitch
8 hours ago
@Michael_B The phrase is relevant as it establishes possible reasons for assessing the relative disparagement of the term. It may be partially begging the question, but it is very relevant. As to speculation, it may be so but disparagement (and other word meaning) is based on assessing hidden mental states.
– Mitch
8 hours ago
|
show 10 more comments
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
In my estimation, it all amounts to a hostile outburst by an angry man. Nothing worth parsing word-for-word.
[“Fredo“] is like the n-word for us.
That's a gross exaggeration. The N-word is used to dehumanize, ridicule and oppress black people. "Fredo" just means the dumb brother.
Cuomo is also being a bit hypocritical having, in jest, applied the term to himself in the past.
Chris Cuomo once referred to himself as ‘Fredo’ in radio interview:
HOST: “There is a group of people — politicos — who always hint they might
run, but not necessarily plunge all the way, and they are members of
la Cuomo.”
CUOMO: “Who am I, then, Fredo?” Cuomo asked in response.
HOST: “Yes, exactly,” Sliwa said. “So you better be careful that your
brother Andrew doesn’t kiss you on both cheeks and then all of a
sudden they take you out on the middle of the lake and where’s Chris?”
CUOMO: “He kisses me plenty because he’s a great big brother,” Cuomo said.
Who knows what motivated his outburst, but one thing's for sure, "Fredo" can be insulting, but not nearly as bad as it gets. Nothing close to the N-word.
1
Could you say when, as far as you can tell, "Fredo" became a slur? Have you ever heard it used against Italian Americans outside the television arena? Is it limited to New York? Thank you, anyway, for your account.
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
In my experience, and I spend a lot of time in New York City and, in particular, Little Italy, "Fredo" is not that big of a deal. It has all the impact of the words "weak" and "fool". So yes, I can see how the word might trigger an angry outburst, but this appears to be an overreaction or maybe even a publicity stunt.
– Michael_B
8 hours ago
1
+1 for the radio link. It seems that "Fredo" was uttered in good humor.
– Mari-Lou A
8 hours ago
@Mari-LouA I agree with Michael here. I grew up in New York and was like 19 when the movie came out, but for a long time as I remember..."Fredo" would be associated with a traitorous and weak younger brother, but the "N-word"? I think that is a stretch. I hate to say this, but it is possible PC is going overboard.///BTW bear in mind I am an ex-pat for the last 35 years.
– Cascabel
3 hours ago
add a comment |
Trump was re-tweeting a late-night comic who is allowed to be funny.
In The Godfather (1972) John Cazale plays the brother Fredo. He eventually takes issue with the way he is treated as the less intelligent gopher, worker bee, by everyone in the organization. The name has taken on this role in popular culture.
The man using "Fredo" as the name professed that he really thought that was Mr. Cuomo's name. I imagine this is what infuriated Mr. Cuomo even more.
There are currently several montages of people in public forums using this term all over the news from some years ago up until recently. It has become the latest offense for which to take umbrage, first or second hand, when there is nothing else worth reporting.
New contributor
And who is this late night comic? Fallon? Corden? Colbert? Kimmel? Trevor Noah?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
Your answer seems to suggest that "Fredo" as as an insult is a recent phenomenon. Could you say when it started? late 80s, early noughties?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
No idea in particular but to suggest it became that since the release of the Godfather movies in the 1970s. Not even an insult but just a reference to one's role, perhaps more derogatory over the years. And No, I don't think this question belongs in this forum.
– Elliot
9 hours ago
You said "There are currently several montages of people in public forums" could you please provide any links that showed this usage before August 13th.
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
Here is a reference to one who made such a montage and then they play it: 560theanswer.com/content/all/morninganswerpodcasts You can begin listening at minute 34:00 or a bit before.
– Elliot
8 hours ago
|
show 2 more comments
I don't think it's "Fredo" specifically that's the insult. Calling someone by a name that's stereotypically associated with their ethnicity is likely to be viewed as racism. So he would have a similar problem if he called him "Luigi" ("Mario" might work for others, but not him, because that's his father's and son's actual names), called an Arab "Muhammed", or called a Mexican "Juan". This type of name-calling conflates all members of the ethnicity, which is practically the definition of racism, although I don't think it's considered as bad as using terms related to stereotyped activities (e.g. "spear-chucker" for black men).
However, Fredo may be insulting in multiple ways. Not only is it a stereotypical name, but it's also a weak character in a movie that emphasizes another stereotype, that Italian-Americans are gangsters.
However, I don't think it's an established, idiomatic insult like the N-word.
add a comment |
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3 Answers
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3 Answers
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oldest
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active
oldest
votes
In my estimation, it all amounts to a hostile outburst by an angry man. Nothing worth parsing word-for-word.
[“Fredo“] is like the n-word for us.
That's a gross exaggeration. The N-word is used to dehumanize, ridicule and oppress black people. "Fredo" just means the dumb brother.
Cuomo is also being a bit hypocritical having, in jest, applied the term to himself in the past.
Chris Cuomo once referred to himself as ‘Fredo’ in radio interview:
HOST: “There is a group of people — politicos — who always hint they might
run, but not necessarily plunge all the way, and they are members of
la Cuomo.”
CUOMO: “Who am I, then, Fredo?” Cuomo asked in response.
HOST: “Yes, exactly,” Sliwa said. “So you better be careful that your
brother Andrew doesn’t kiss you on both cheeks and then all of a
sudden they take you out on the middle of the lake and where’s Chris?”
CUOMO: “He kisses me plenty because he’s a great big brother,” Cuomo said.
Who knows what motivated his outburst, but one thing's for sure, "Fredo" can be insulting, but not nearly as bad as it gets. Nothing close to the N-word.
1
Could you say when, as far as you can tell, "Fredo" became a slur? Have you ever heard it used against Italian Americans outside the television arena? Is it limited to New York? Thank you, anyway, for your account.
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
In my experience, and I spend a lot of time in New York City and, in particular, Little Italy, "Fredo" is not that big of a deal. It has all the impact of the words "weak" and "fool". So yes, I can see how the word might trigger an angry outburst, but this appears to be an overreaction or maybe even a publicity stunt.
– Michael_B
8 hours ago
1
+1 for the radio link. It seems that "Fredo" was uttered in good humor.
– Mari-Lou A
8 hours ago
@Mari-LouA I agree with Michael here. I grew up in New York and was like 19 when the movie came out, but for a long time as I remember..."Fredo" would be associated with a traitorous and weak younger brother, but the "N-word"? I think that is a stretch. I hate to say this, but it is possible PC is going overboard.///BTW bear in mind I am an ex-pat for the last 35 years.
– Cascabel
3 hours ago
add a comment |
In my estimation, it all amounts to a hostile outburst by an angry man. Nothing worth parsing word-for-word.
[“Fredo“] is like the n-word for us.
That's a gross exaggeration. The N-word is used to dehumanize, ridicule and oppress black people. "Fredo" just means the dumb brother.
Cuomo is also being a bit hypocritical having, in jest, applied the term to himself in the past.
Chris Cuomo once referred to himself as ‘Fredo’ in radio interview:
HOST: “There is a group of people — politicos — who always hint they might
run, but not necessarily plunge all the way, and they are members of
la Cuomo.”
CUOMO: “Who am I, then, Fredo?” Cuomo asked in response.
HOST: “Yes, exactly,” Sliwa said. “So you better be careful that your
brother Andrew doesn’t kiss you on both cheeks and then all of a
sudden they take you out on the middle of the lake and where’s Chris?”
CUOMO: “He kisses me plenty because he’s a great big brother,” Cuomo said.
Who knows what motivated his outburst, but one thing's for sure, "Fredo" can be insulting, but not nearly as bad as it gets. Nothing close to the N-word.
1
Could you say when, as far as you can tell, "Fredo" became a slur? Have you ever heard it used against Italian Americans outside the television arena? Is it limited to New York? Thank you, anyway, for your account.
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
In my experience, and I spend a lot of time in New York City and, in particular, Little Italy, "Fredo" is not that big of a deal. It has all the impact of the words "weak" and "fool". So yes, I can see how the word might trigger an angry outburst, but this appears to be an overreaction or maybe even a publicity stunt.
– Michael_B
8 hours ago
1
+1 for the radio link. It seems that "Fredo" was uttered in good humor.
– Mari-Lou A
8 hours ago
@Mari-LouA I agree with Michael here. I grew up in New York and was like 19 when the movie came out, but for a long time as I remember..."Fredo" would be associated with a traitorous and weak younger brother, but the "N-word"? I think that is a stretch. I hate to say this, but it is possible PC is going overboard.///BTW bear in mind I am an ex-pat for the last 35 years.
– Cascabel
3 hours ago
add a comment |
In my estimation, it all amounts to a hostile outburst by an angry man. Nothing worth parsing word-for-word.
[“Fredo“] is like the n-word for us.
That's a gross exaggeration. The N-word is used to dehumanize, ridicule and oppress black people. "Fredo" just means the dumb brother.
Cuomo is also being a bit hypocritical having, in jest, applied the term to himself in the past.
Chris Cuomo once referred to himself as ‘Fredo’ in radio interview:
HOST: “There is a group of people — politicos — who always hint they might
run, but not necessarily plunge all the way, and they are members of
la Cuomo.”
CUOMO: “Who am I, then, Fredo?” Cuomo asked in response.
HOST: “Yes, exactly,” Sliwa said. “So you better be careful that your
brother Andrew doesn’t kiss you on both cheeks and then all of a
sudden they take you out on the middle of the lake and where’s Chris?”
CUOMO: “He kisses me plenty because he’s a great big brother,” Cuomo said.
Who knows what motivated his outburst, but one thing's for sure, "Fredo" can be insulting, but not nearly as bad as it gets. Nothing close to the N-word.
In my estimation, it all amounts to a hostile outburst by an angry man. Nothing worth parsing word-for-word.
[“Fredo“] is like the n-word for us.
That's a gross exaggeration. The N-word is used to dehumanize, ridicule and oppress black people. "Fredo" just means the dumb brother.
Cuomo is also being a bit hypocritical having, in jest, applied the term to himself in the past.
Chris Cuomo once referred to himself as ‘Fredo’ in radio interview:
HOST: “There is a group of people — politicos — who always hint they might
run, but not necessarily plunge all the way, and they are members of
la Cuomo.”
CUOMO: “Who am I, then, Fredo?” Cuomo asked in response.
HOST: “Yes, exactly,” Sliwa said. “So you better be careful that your
brother Andrew doesn’t kiss you on both cheeks and then all of a
sudden they take you out on the middle of the lake and where’s Chris?”
CUOMO: “He kisses me plenty because he’s a great big brother,” Cuomo said.
Who knows what motivated his outburst, but one thing's for sure, "Fredo" can be insulting, but not nearly as bad as it gets. Nothing close to the N-word.
edited 7 hours ago
answered 9 hours ago
Michael_BMichael_B
3,4751 gold badge11 silver badges20 bronze badges
3,4751 gold badge11 silver badges20 bronze badges
1
Could you say when, as far as you can tell, "Fredo" became a slur? Have you ever heard it used against Italian Americans outside the television arena? Is it limited to New York? Thank you, anyway, for your account.
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
In my experience, and I spend a lot of time in New York City and, in particular, Little Italy, "Fredo" is not that big of a deal. It has all the impact of the words "weak" and "fool". So yes, I can see how the word might trigger an angry outburst, but this appears to be an overreaction or maybe even a publicity stunt.
– Michael_B
8 hours ago
1
+1 for the radio link. It seems that "Fredo" was uttered in good humor.
– Mari-Lou A
8 hours ago
@Mari-LouA I agree with Michael here. I grew up in New York and was like 19 when the movie came out, but for a long time as I remember..."Fredo" would be associated with a traitorous and weak younger brother, but the "N-word"? I think that is a stretch. I hate to say this, but it is possible PC is going overboard.///BTW bear in mind I am an ex-pat for the last 35 years.
– Cascabel
3 hours ago
add a comment |
1
Could you say when, as far as you can tell, "Fredo" became a slur? Have you ever heard it used against Italian Americans outside the television arena? Is it limited to New York? Thank you, anyway, for your account.
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
In my experience, and I spend a lot of time in New York City and, in particular, Little Italy, "Fredo" is not that big of a deal. It has all the impact of the words "weak" and "fool". So yes, I can see how the word might trigger an angry outburst, but this appears to be an overreaction or maybe even a publicity stunt.
– Michael_B
8 hours ago
1
+1 for the radio link. It seems that "Fredo" was uttered in good humor.
– Mari-Lou A
8 hours ago
@Mari-LouA I agree with Michael here. I grew up in New York and was like 19 when the movie came out, but for a long time as I remember..."Fredo" would be associated with a traitorous and weak younger brother, but the "N-word"? I think that is a stretch. I hate to say this, but it is possible PC is going overboard.///BTW bear in mind I am an ex-pat for the last 35 years.
– Cascabel
3 hours ago
1
1
Could you say when, as far as you can tell, "Fredo" became a slur? Have you ever heard it used against Italian Americans outside the television arena? Is it limited to New York? Thank you, anyway, for your account.
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
Could you say when, as far as you can tell, "Fredo" became a slur? Have you ever heard it used against Italian Americans outside the television arena? Is it limited to New York? Thank you, anyway, for your account.
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
1
In my experience, and I spend a lot of time in New York City and, in particular, Little Italy, "Fredo" is not that big of a deal. It has all the impact of the words "weak" and "fool". So yes, I can see how the word might trigger an angry outburst, but this appears to be an overreaction or maybe even a publicity stunt.
– Michael_B
8 hours ago
In my experience, and I spend a lot of time in New York City and, in particular, Little Italy, "Fredo" is not that big of a deal. It has all the impact of the words "weak" and "fool". So yes, I can see how the word might trigger an angry outburst, but this appears to be an overreaction or maybe even a publicity stunt.
– Michael_B
8 hours ago
1
1
+1 for the radio link. It seems that "Fredo" was uttered in good humor.
– Mari-Lou A
8 hours ago
+1 for the radio link. It seems that "Fredo" was uttered in good humor.
– Mari-Lou A
8 hours ago
@Mari-LouA I agree with Michael here. I grew up in New York and was like 19 when the movie came out, but for a long time as I remember..."Fredo" would be associated with a traitorous and weak younger brother, but the "N-word"? I think that is a stretch. I hate to say this, but it is possible PC is going overboard.///BTW bear in mind I am an ex-pat for the last 35 years.
– Cascabel
3 hours ago
@Mari-LouA I agree with Michael here. I grew up in New York and was like 19 when the movie came out, but for a long time as I remember..."Fredo" would be associated with a traitorous and weak younger brother, but the "N-word"? I think that is a stretch. I hate to say this, but it is possible PC is going overboard.///BTW bear in mind I am an ex-pat for the last 35 years.
– Cascabel
3 hours ago
add a comment |
Trump was re-tweeting a late-night comic who is allowed to be funny.
In The Godfather (1972) John Cazale plays the brother Fredo. He eventually takes issue with the way he is treated as the less intelligent gopher, worker bee, by everyone in the organization. The name has taken on this role in popular culture.
The man using "Fredo" as the name professed that he really thought that was Mr. Cuomo's name. I imagine this is what infuriated Mr. Cuomo even more.
There are currently several montages of people in public forums using this term all over the news from some years ago up until recently. It has become the latest offense for which to take umbrage, first or second hand, when there is nothing else worth reporting.
New contributor
And who is this late night comic? Fallon? Corden? Colbert? Kimmel? Trevor Noah?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
Your answer seems to suggest that "Fredo" as as an insult is a recent phenomenon. Could you say when it started? late 80s, early noughties?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
No idea in particular but to suggest it became that since the release of the Godfather movies in the 1970s. Not even an insult but just a reference to one's role, perhaps more derogatory over the years. And No, I don't think this question belongs in this forum.
– Elliot
9 hours ago
You said "There are currently several montages of people in public forums" could you please provide any links that showed this usage before August 13th.
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
Here is a reference to one who made such a montage and then they play it: 560theanswer.com/content/all/morninganswerpodcasts You can begin listening at minute 34:00 or a bit before.
– Elliot
8 hours ago
|
show 2 more comments
Trump was re-tweeting a late-night comic who is allowed to be funny.
In The Godfather (1972) John Cazale plays the brother Fredo. He eventually takes issue with the way he is treated as the less intelligent gopher, worker bee, by everyone in the organization. The name has taken on this role in popular culture.
The man using "Fredo" as the name professed that he really thought that was Mr. Cuomo's name. I imagine this is what infuriated Mr. Cuomo even more.
There are currently several montages of people in public forums using this term all over the news from some years ago up until recently. It has become the latest offense for which to take umbrage, first or second hand, when there is nothing else worth reporting.
New contributor
And who is this late night comic? Fallon? Corden? Colbert? Kimmel? Trevor Noah?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
Your answer seems to suggest that "Fredo" as as an insult is a recent phenomenon. Could you say when it started? late 80s, early noughties?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
No idea in particular but to suggest it became that since the release of the Godfather movies in the 1970s. Not even an insult but just a reference to one's role, perhaps more derogatory over the years. And No, I don't think this question belongs in this forum.
– Elliot
9 hours ago
You said "There are currently several montages of people in public forums" could you please provide any links that showed this usage before August 13th.
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
Here is a reference to one who made such a montage and then they play it: 560theanswer.com/content/all/morninganswerpodcasts You can begin listening at minute 34:00 or a bit before.
– Elliot
8 hours ago
|
show 2 more comments
Trump was re-tweeting a late-night comic who is allowed to be funny.
In The Godfather (1972) John Cazale plays the brother Fredo. He eventually takes issue with the way he is treated as the less intelligent gopher, worker bee, by everyone in the organization. The name has taken on this role in popular culture.
The man using "Fredo" as the name professed that he really thought that was Mr. Cuomo's name. I imagine this is what infuriated Mr. Cuomo even more.
There are currently several montages of people in public forums using this term all over the news from some years ago up until recently. It has become the latest offense for which to take umbrage, first or second hand, when there is nothing else worth reporting.
New contributor
Trump was re-tweeting a late-night comic who is allowed to be funny.
In The Godfather (1972) John Cazale plays the brother Fredo. He eventually takes issue with the way he is treated as the less intelligent gopher, worker bee, by everyone in the organization. The name has taken on this role in popular culture.
The man using "Fredo" as the name professed that he really thought that was Mr. Cuomo's name. I imagine this is what infuriated Mr. Cuomo even more.
There are currently several montages of people in public forums using this term all over the news from some years ago up until recently. It has become the latest offense for which to take umbrage, first or second hand, when there is nothing else worth reporting.
New contributor
edited 9 hours ago
New contributor
answered 9 hours ago
ElliotElliot
112 bronze badges
112 bronze badges
New contributor
New contributor
And who is this late night comic? Fallon? Corden? Colbert? Kimmel? Trevor Noah?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
Your answer seems to suggest that "Fredo" as as an insult is a recent phenomenon. Could you say when it started? late 80s, early noughties?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
No idea in particular but to suggest it became that since the release of the Godfather movies in the 1970s. Not even an insult but just a reference to one's role, perhaps more derogatory over the years. And No, I don't think this question belongs in this forum.
– Elliot
9 hours ago
You said "There are currently several montages of people in public forums" could you please provide any links that showed this usage before August 13th.
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
Here is a reference to one who made such a montage and then they play it: 560theanswer.com/content/all/morninganswerpodcasts You can begin listening at minute 34:00 or a bit before.
– Elliot
8 hours ago
|
show 2 more comments
And who is this late night comic? Fallon? Corden? Colbert? Kimmel? Trevor Noah?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
Your answer seems to suggest that "Fredo" as as an insult is a recent phenomenon. Could you say when it started? late 80s, early noughties?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
No idea in particular but to suggest it became that since the release of the Godfather movies in the 1970s. Not even an insult but just a reference to one's role, perhaps more derogatory over the years. And No, I don't think this question belongs in this forum.
– Elliot
9 hours ago
You said "There are currently several montages of people in public forums" could you please provide any links that showed this usage before August 13th.
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
Here is a reference to one who made such a montage and then they play it: 560theanswer.com/content/all/morninganswerpodcasts You can begin listening at minute 34:00 or a bit before.
– Elliot
8 hours ago
And who is this late night comic? Fallon? Corden? Colbert? Kimmel? Trevor Noah?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
And who is this late night comic? Fallon? Corden? Colbert? Kimmel? Trevor Noah?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
1
Your answer seems to suggest that "Fredo" as as an insult is a recent phenomenon. Could you say when it started? late 80s, early noughties?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
Your answer seems to suggest that "Fredo" as as an insult is a recent phenomenon. Could you say when it started? late 80s, early noughties?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
No idea in particular but to suggest it became that since the release of the Godfather movies in the 1970s. Not even an insult but just a reference to one's role, perhaps more derogatory over the years. And No, I don't think this question belongs in this forum.
– Elliot
9 hours ago
No idea in particular but to suggest it became that since the release of the Godfather movies in the 1970s. Not even an insult but just a reference to one's role, perhaps more derogatory over the years. And No, I don't think this question belongs in this forum.
– Elliot
9 hours ago
You said "There are currently several montages of people in public forums" could you please provide any links that showed this usage before August 13th.
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
You said "There are currently several montages of people in public forums" could you please provide any links that showed this usage before August 13th.
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
1
Here is a reference to one who made such a montage and then they play it: 560theanswer.com/content/all/morninganswerpodcasts You can begin listening at minute 34:00 or a bit before.
– Elliot
8 hours ago
Here is a reference to one who made such a montage and then they play it: 560theanswer.com/content/all/morninganswerpodcasts You can begin listening at minute 34:00 or a bit before.
– Elliot
8 hours ago
|
show 2 more comments
I don't think it's "Fredo" specifically that's the insult. Calling someone by a name that's stereotypically associated with their ethnicity is likely to be viewed as racism. So he would have a similar problem if he called him "Luigi" ("Mario" might work for others, but not him, because that's his father's and son's actual names), called an Arab "Muhammed", or called a Mexican "Juan". This type of name-calling conflates all members of the ethnicity, which is practically the definition of racism, although I don't think it's considered as bad as using terms related to stereotyped activities (e.g. "spear-chucker" for black men).
However, Fredo may be insulting in multiple ways. Not only is it a stereotypical name, but it's also a weak character in a movie that emphasizes another stereotype, that Italian-Americans are gangsters.
However, I don't think it's an established, idiomatic insult like the N-word.
add a comment |
I don't think it's "Fredo" specifically that's the insult. Calling someone by a name that's stereotypically associated with their ethnicity is likely to be viewed as racism. So he would have a similar problem if he called him "Luigi" ("Mario" might work for others, but not him, because that's his father's and son's actual names), called an Arab "Muhammed", or called a Mexican "Juan". This type of name-calling conflates all members of the ethnicity, which is practically the definition of racism, although I don't think it's considered as bad as using terms related to stereotyped activities (e.g. "spear-chucker" for black men).
However, Fredo may be insulting in multiple ways. Not only is it a stereotypical name, but it's also a weak character in a movie that emphasizes another stereotype, that Italian-Americans are gangsters.
However, I don't think it's an established, idiomatic insult like the N-word.
add a comment |
I don't think it's "Fredo" specifically that's the insult. Calling someone by a name that's stereotypically associated with their ethnicity is likely to be viewed as racism. So he would have a similar problem if he called him "Luigi" ("Mario" might work for others, but not him, because that's his father's and son's actual names), called an Arab "Muhammed", or called a Mexican "Juan". This type of name-calling conflates all members of the ethnicity, which is practically the definition of racism, although I don't think it's considered as bad as using terms related to stereotyped activities (e.g. "spear-chucker" for black men).
However, Fredo may be insulting in multiple ways. Not only is it a stereotypical name, but it's also a weak character in a movie that emphasizes another stereotype, that Italian-Americans are gangsters.
However, I don't think it's an established, idiomatic insult like the N-word.
I don't think it's "Fredo" specifically that's the insult. Calling someone by a name that's stereotypically associated with their ethnicity is likely to be viewed as racism. So he would have a similar problem if he called him "Luigi" ("Mario" might work for others, but not him, because that's his father's and son's actual names), called an Arab "Muhammed", or called a Mexican "Juan". This type of name-calling conflates all members of the ethnicity, which is practically the definition of racism, although I don't think it's considered as bad as using terms related to stereotyped activities (e.g. "spear-chucker" for black men).
However, Fredo may be insulting in multiple ways. Not only is it a stereotypical name, but it's also a weak character in a movie that emphasizes another stereotype, that Italian-Americans are gangsters.
However, I don't think it's an established, idiomatic insult like the N-word.
answered 16 mins ago
BarmarBarmar
10.7k17 silver badges33 bronze badges
10.7k17 silver badges33 bronze badges
add a comment |
add a comment |
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2
I always heard "Guido" that way, but not "Fredo". Interesting.
– Cascabel
9 hours ago
3
@Cascabel Same here. Guido I’m familiar with; Fredo is new to me as anything but an actual short form of Alfredo.
– Janus Bahs Jacquet
9 hours ago
You may want to consider removing the phrase, "... (probably seeking to bait Cuomo) … ". It's not relevant to your post and represents pure speculation.
– Michael_B
9 hours ago
2
@Michael_B My post is perfectly unbiased. I tried to be as impartial as possible, that also includes a plausible explanation as to why Cuomo continued to heavily swear and threaten the man with violence. Should I leave out the expletives, and the reference to using physical violence also?
– Mari-Lou A
9 hours ago
1
@Michael_B The phrase is relevant as it establishes possible reasons for assessing the relative disparagement of the term. It may be partially begging the question, but it is very relevant. As to speculation, it may be so but disparagement (and other word meaning) is based on assessing hidden mental states.
– Mitch
8 hours ago