Safety when modifying old electrical workWhen wiring a switch loop, which wire is which?low voltage from circuit - bad breaker?Did I damage the breaker by incorrectly wiring a generator?Trying to hook up 2 new lights and 1 outletProtecting multiple outlets with one GFCI; is it possible with this wiring scheme?Loud Noise, possibly electrical, from somewhere in the houseHow to wire GCFI's with 2 Hots and a single NeutralBad GFCI or did I wire it wrong?Electrical issueAFCI Breaker Randomly Tripping - No New DevicesBreaker Trips When Light Switch Is Turned On
What's tha name for when you write multiple voices on same staff? And are there any cons?
Would an 8% reduction in drag outweigh the weight addition from this custom CFD-tested winglet?
Anabelian geometry ~ higher category theory
Program which behaves differently in/out of a debugger
If current results hold, Man City would win PL title
Solubility in different pressure conditions
Can a tourist shoot a gun in the USA?
Area under the curve - Integrals (Antiderivatives)
German characters on US-International keyboard layout
Why does my circuit work on a breadboard, but not on a perfboard? I am new to soldering
Where to find every-day healthy food near Heathrow Airport?
Interior smooth regularity
Automatically anti-predictably assemble an alliterative aria
On studying Computer Science vs. Software Engineering to become a proficient coder
Is there any good reason to write "it is easy to see"?
How do I interpret improvement in AUC ROC from the business perspective?
Is there ever any indication in the MCU as to how Spider-Man got his powers?
correct spelling of "carruffel" (fuzz, hustle, all that jazz)
Why is it harder to turn a motor/generator with shorted terminals?
Earliest use of "rookie"?
Anatomically Correct Carnivorous Tree
Can I say: "When was your train leaving?" if the train leaves in the future?
Do I need to say 'o`clock'?
Why in the below sentence dative "dem" is used instead of nominative "der"?
Safety when modifying old electrical work
When wiring a switch loop, which wire is which?low voltage from circuit - bad breaker?Did I damage the breaker by incorrectly wiring a generator?Trying to hook up 2 new lights and 1 outletProtecting multiple outlets with one GFCI; is it possible with this wiring scheme?Loud Noise, possibly electrical, from somewhere in the houseHow to wire GCFI's with 2 Hots and a single NeutralBad GFCI or did I wire it wrong?Electrical issueAFCI Breaker Randomly Tripping - No New DevicesBreaker Trips When Light Switch Is Turned On
.everyoneloves__top-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__mid-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__bot-mid-leaderboard:empty margin-bottom:0;
I have a relatively old house, built in the 1950s. I am slowly updating it to have smart switches etc., but the existing electrical wiring is fairly haphazard. Just yesterday I replaced a dimmer switch and found that the white wire pigtail in the box was in fact hooked up to hot, not neutral. Fortunately when I turned on the circuit it tripped the GFCI before doing any damage but I wonder if there's a better way to avoid this in the future.
Currently I just turn off the circuit at the breaker and verify there's nothing live in the box with a non-contact tester (and then an insulated screwdriver, just to be sure). Should I be pulling the wires out, switching the circuit back on, and then testing each wire individually with a multimeter (sometimes the nc tester gives false positives) before doing any work? And if I do find a wire incorrectly colored, is there a good way to label it as such?
Also, what would have happened if the switch I talked about above hadn't tripped the GFCI? When I turned the circuit back on, would the breaker immediately switch it off, or would there be a fire hazard?
electrical safety old-house
asked 3 hours ago
MooseBoysMooseBoys
1457
add a comment |
I have a relatively old house, built in the 1950s. I am slowly updating it to have smart switches etc., but the existing electrical wiring is fairly haphazard. Just yesterday I replaced a dimmer switch and found that the white wire pigtail in the box was in fact hooked up to hot, not neutral. Fortunately when I turned on the circuit it tripped the GFCI before doing any damage but I wonder if there's a better way to avoid this in the future.
Currently I just turn off the circuit at the breaker and verify there's nothing live in the box with a non-contact tester (and then an insulated screwdriver, just to be sure). Should I be pulling the wires out, switching the circuit back on, and then testing each wire individually with a multimeter (sometimes the nc tester gives false positives) before doing any work? And if I do find a wire incorrectly colored, is there a good way to label it as such?
Also, what would have happened if the switch I talked about above hadn't tripped the GFCI? When I turned the circuit back on, would the breaker immediately switch it off, or would there be a fire hazard?
electrical safety old-house
asked 3 hours ago
MooseBoysMooseBoys
1457
2
Learn what a switch loop is. That probably won't be the only one you find. diy.stackexchange.com/questions/31700/…
– Ecnerwal
3 hours ago
2
In short, it will not be unusual to find that many of your switch locations will not support a smart switch without rewiring the building, as they will not have ANY neutral conductor provided. That was the way it was done for a long time, and it was code until 2011. They should be re-marked black or red, but they often are not in practice, or it wasn't very permanent after all.
– Ecnerwal
3 hours ago
add a comment |
I have a relatively old house, built in the 1950s. I am slowly updating it to have smart switches etc., but the existing electrical wiring is fairly haphazard. Just yesterday I replaced a dimmer switch and found that the white wire pigtail in the box was in fact hooked up to hot, not neutral. Fortunately when I turned on the circuit it tripped the GFCI before doing any damage but I wonder if there's a better way to avoid this in the future.
Currently I just turn off the circuit at the breaker and verify there's nothing live in the box with a non-contact tester (and then an insulated screwdriver, just to be sure). Should I be pulling the wires out, switching the circuit back on, and then testing each wire individually with a multimeter (sometimes the nc tester gives false positives) before doing any work? And if I do find a wire incorrectly colored, is there a good way to label it as such?
Also, what would have happened if the switch I talked about above hadn't tripped the GFCI? When I turned the circuit back on, would the breaker immediately switch it off, or would there be a fire hazard?
electrical safety old-house
asked 3 hours ago
MooseBoysMooseBoys
1457
I have a relatively old house, built in the 1950s. I am slowly updating it to have smart switches etc., but the existing electrical wiring is fairly haphazard. Just yesterday I replaced a dimmer switch and found that the white wire pigtail in the box was in fact hooked up to hot, not neutral. Fortunately when I turned on the circuit it tripped the GFCI before doing any damage but I wonder if there's a better way to avoid this in the future.
Currently I just turn off the circuit at the breaker and verify there's nothing live in the box with a non-contact tester (and then an insulated screwdriver, just to be sure). Should I be pulling the wires out, switching the circuit back on, and then testing each wire individually with a multimeter (sometimes the nc tester gives false positives) before doing any work? And if I do find a wire incorrectly colored, is there a good way to label it as such?
Also, what would have happened if the switch I talked about above hadn't tripped the GFCI? When I turned the circuit back on, would the breaker immediately switch it off, or would there be a fire hazard?
electrical safety old-house
electrical safety old-house
asked 3 hours ago
MooseBoysMooseBoys
1457
asked 3 hours ago
MooseBoysMooseBoys
1457
asked 3 hours ago
MooseBoysMooseBoys
1457
asked 3 hours ago
MooseBoysMooseBoys
1457
asked 3 hours ago
MooseBoysMooseBoys
1457
1457
2
Learn what a switch loop is. That probably won't be the only one you find. diy.stackexchange.com/questions/31700/…
– Ecnerwal
3 hours ago
2
In short, it will not be unusual to find that many of your switch locations will not support a smart switch without rewiring the building, as they will not have ANY neutral conductor provided. That was the way it was done for a long time, and it was code until 2011. They should be re-marked black or red, but they often are not in practice, or it wasn't very permanent after all.
– Ecnerwal
3 hours ago
add a comment |
2
Learn what a switch loop is. That probably won't be the only one you find. diy.stackexchange.com/questions/31700/…
– Ecnerwal
3 hours ago
2
In short, it will not be unusual to find that many of your switch locations will not support a smart switch without rewiring the building, as they will not have ANY neutral conductor provided. That was the way it was done for a long time, and it was code until 2011. They should be re-marked black or red, but they often are not in practice, or it wasn't very permanent after all.
– Ecnerwal
3 hours ago
2
2
Learn what a switch loop is. That probably won't be the only one you find. diy.stackexchange.com/questions/31700/…
– Ecnerwal
3 hours ago
Learn what a switch loop is. That probably won't be the only one you find. diy.stackexchange.com/questions/31700/…
– Ecnerwal
3 hours ago
2
2
In short, it will not be unusual to find that many of your switch locations will not support a smart switch without rewiring the building, as they will not have ANY neutral conductor provided. That was the way it was done for a long time, and it was code until 2011. They should be re-marked black or red, but they often are not in practice, or it wasn't very permanent after all.
– Ecnerwal
3 hours ago
In short, it will not be unusual to find that many of your switch locations will not support a smart switch without rewiring the building, as they will not have ANY neutral conductor provided. That was the way it was done for a long time, and it was code until 2011. They should be re-marked black or red, but they often are not in practice, or it wasn't very permanent after all.
– Ecnerwal
3 hours ago
add a comment |
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
Wires in electrical wiring are NOT color coded
Your mistake there was assuming white meant neutral. The simple fact is that electrical wiring is not color coded. That's because cables are manufactured with only one set of colors - black and white for /2 cable or black, white and red for /3. No matter what function the wire has, it must "make do" with the colors available in standard cable.
Any colors you want, as long as you want black, white and maybe red.
There are only 2 color rules.
- Grounds are always and only, green, yellow-green or bare. Those colors can only be ground.
- Neutrals can only be white or mid-gray, but that only applies if this cable has a neutral. If this cable doesn't need a neutral, white can be a hot. You're supposed to mark it with paint or tape, but previously you could skip it if the usage was "obvious". (to an electrician, heh).
This last one is what bit you.
Smart switches have special needs
You should have opened up your switch and investigated the wires that were available to you, before you bought the switch. If you only see 2 wires (besides ground), they must be always-hot and switched-hot, because a switch can't work without those two.
If your location doesn't have neutral, don't buy a smart switch that needs it.
If your location doesn't have ground, ditto.
You may hear things that tempt you to use ground for neutral or vice versa. Don't. Neutral is not ground.
There are smart switches that require neither neutral nor ground. They may require at least one of the bulbs to be compatible LED, incandescent, or a capacitor-resistor bypass added.
There are also other ways to work around the problem, such as smart switches that put a switching module up in the ceiling rose, then the wall switch effectively becomes a "remote" for the module.
answered 53 mins ago
HarperHarper
78.9k552158
add a comment |
First of all, id the related light controlled from more than one location? If so, check this out (any time the white wire is used as hot it should be wrapped with black tape inside the box!
https://www2.familyhandyman.com/electrical/wiring-switches/how-to-wire-a-threeway-switch/view-all
answered 2 hours ago
Larry BirtLarry Birt
663
This is interesting, but doesn't answer the original question. Please take our tour so you'll know how better to contribute here.
– Daniel Griscom
17 mins ago
add a comment |
Your Answer
StackExchange.ready(function()
var channelOptions =
tags: "".split(" "),
id: "73"
;
initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);
StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function()
// Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled)
StackExchange.using("snippets", function()
createEditor();
);
else
createEditor();
);
function createEditor()
StackExchange.prepareEditor(
heartbeatType: 'answer',
autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
convertImagesToLinks: false,
noModals: true,
showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
reputationToPostImages: null,
bindNavPrevention: true,
postfix: "",
imageUploader:
brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
allowUrls: true
,
noCode: true, onDemand: true,
discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
);
);
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function ()
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fdiy.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f164964%2fsafety-when-modifying-old-electrical-work%23new-answer', 'question_page');
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
Wires in electrical wiring are NOT color coded
Your mistake there was assuming white meant neutral. The simple fact is that electrical wiring is not color coded. That's because cables are manufactured with only one set of colors - black and white for /2 cable or black, white and red for /3. No matter what function the wire has, it must "make do" with the colors available in standard cable.
Any colors you want, as long as you want black, white and maybe red.
There are only 2 color rules.
- Grounds are always and only, green, yellow-green or bare. Those colors can only be ground.
- Neutrals can only be white or mid-gray, but that only applies if this cable has a neutral. If this cable doesn't need a neutral, white can be a hot. You're supposed to mark it with paint or tape, but previously you could skip it if the usage was "obvious". (to an electrician, heh).
This last one is what bit you.
Smart switches have special needs
You should have opened up your switch and investigated the wires that were available to you, before you bought the switch. If you only see 2 wires (besides ground), they must be always-hot and switched-hot, because a switch can't work without those two.
If your location doesn't have neutral, don't buy a smart switch that needs it.
If your location doesn't have ground, ditto.
You may hear things that tempt you to use ground for neutral or vice versa. Don't. Neutral is not ground.
There are smart switches that require neither neutral nor ground. They may require at least one of the bulbs to be compatible LED, incandescent, or a capacitor-resistor bypass added.
There are also other ways to work around the problem, such as smart switches that put a switching module up in the ceiling rose, then the wall switch effectively becomes a "remote" for the module.
answered 53 mins ago
HarperHarper
78.9k552158
add a comment |
Wires in electrical wiring are NOT color coded
Your mistake there was assuming white meant neutral. The simple fact is that electrical wiring is not color coded. That's because cables are manufactured with only one set of colors - black and white for /2 cable or black, white and red for /3. No matter what function the wire has, it must "make do" with the colors available in standard cable.
Any colors you want, as long as you want black, white and maybe red.
There are only 2 color rules.
- Grounds are always and only, green, yellow-green or bare. Those colors can only be ground.
- Neutrals can only be white or mid-gray, but that only applies if this cable has a neutral. If this cable doesn't need a neutral, white can be a hot. You're supposed to mark it with paint or tape, but previously you could skip it if the usage was "obvious". (to an electrician, heh).
This last one is what bit you.
Smart switches have special needs
You should have opened up your switch and investigated the wires that were available to you, before you bought the switch. If you only see 2 wires (besides ground), they must be always-hot and switched-hot, because a switch can't work without those two.
If your location doesn't have neutral, don't buy a smart switch that needs it.
If your location doesn't have ground, ditto.
You may hear things that tempt you to use ground for neutral or vice versa. Don't. Neutral is not ground.
There are smart switches that require neither neutral nor ground. They may require at least one of the bulbs to be compatible LED, incandescent, or a capacitor-resistor bypass added.
There are also other ways to work around the problem, such as smart switches that put a switching module up in the ceiling rose, then the wall switch effectively becomes a "remote" for the module.
answered 53 mins ago
HarperHarper
78.9k552158
add a comment |
Wires in electrical wiring are NOT color coded
Your mistake there was assuming white meant neutral. The simple fact is that electrical wiring is not color coded. That's because cables are manufactured with only one set of colors - black and white for /2 cable or black, white and red for /3. No matter what function the wire has, it must "make do" with the colors available in standard cable.
Any colors you want, as long as you want black, white and maybe red.
There are only 2 color rules.
- Grounds are always and only, green, yellow-green or bare. Those colors can only be ground.
- Neutrals can only be white or mid-gray, but that only applies if this cable has a neutral. If this cable doesn't need a neutral, white can be a hot. You're supposed to mark it with paint or tape, but previously you could skip it if the usage was "obvious". (to an electrician, heh).
This last one is what bit you.
Smart switches have special needs
You should have opened up your switch and investigated the wires that were available to you, before you bought the switch. If you only see 2 wires (besides ground), they must be always-hot and switched-hot, because a switch can't work without those two.
If your location doesn't have neutral, don't buy a smart switch that needs it.
If your location doesn't have ground, ditto.
You may hear things that tempt you to use ground for neutral or vice versa. Don't. Neutral is not ground.
There are smart switches that require neither neutral nor ground. They may require at least one of the bulbs to be compatible LED, incandescent, or a capacitor-resistor bypass added.
There are also other ways to work around the problem, such as smart switches that put a switching module up in the ceiling rose, then the wall switch effectively becomes a "remote" for the module.
answered 53 mins ago
HarperHarper
78.9k552158
Wires in electrical wiring are NOT color coded
Your mistake there was assuming white meant neutral. The simple fact is that electrical wiring is not color coded. That's because cables are manufactured with only one set of colors - black and white for /2 cable or black, white and red for /3. No matter what function the wire has, it must "make do" with the colors available in standard cable.
Any colors you want, as long as you want black, white and maybe red.
There are only 2 color rules.
- Grounds are always and only, green, yellow-green or bare. Those colors can only be ground.
- Neutrals can only be white or mid-gray, but that only applies if this cable has a neutral. If this cable doesn't need a neutral, white can be a hot. You're supposed to mark it with paint or tape, but previously you could skip it if the usage was "obvious". (to an electrician, heh).
This last one is what bit you.
Smart switches have special needs
You should have opened up your switch and investigated the wires that were available to you, before you bought the switch. If you only see 2 wires (besides ground), they must be always-hot and switched-hot, because a switch can't work without those two.
If your location doesn't have neutral, don't buy a smart switch that needs it.
If your location doesn't have ground, ditto.
You may hear things that tempt you to use ground for neutral or vice versa. Don't. Neutral is not ground.
There are smart switches that require neither neutral nor ground. They may require at least one of the bulbs to be compatible LED, incandescent, or a capacitor-resistor bypass added.
There are also other ways to work around the problem, such as smart switches that put a switching module up in the ceiling rose, then the wall switch effectively becomes a "remote" for the module.
answered 53 mins ago
HarperHarper
78.9k552158
edited 39 mins ago
answered 53 mins ago
HarperHarper
78.9k552158
answered 53 mins ago
HarperHarper
78.9k552158
answered 53 mins ago
HarperHarper
78.9k552158
78.9k552158
add a comment |
add a comment |
First of all, id the related light controlled from more than one location? If so, check this out (any time the white wire is used as hot it should be wrapped with black tape inside the box!
https://www2.familyhandyman.com/electrical/wiring-switches/how-to-wire-a-threeway-switch/view-all
answered 2 hours ago
Larry BirtLarry Birt
663
This is interesting, but doesn't answer the original question. Please take our tour so you'll know how better to contribute here.
– Daniel Griscom
17 mins ago
add a comment |
First of all, id the related light controlled from more than one location? If so, check this out (any time the white wire is used as hot it should be wrapped with black tape inside the box!
https://www2.familyhandyman.com/electrical/wiring-switches/how-to-wire-a-threeway-switch/view-all
answered 2 hours ago
Larry BirtLarry Birt
663
This is interesting, but doesn't answer the original question. Please take our tour so you'll know how better to contribute here.
– Daniel Griscom
17 mins ago
add a comment |
First of all, id the related light controlled from more than one location? If so, check this out (any time the white wire is used as hot it should be wrapped with black tape inside the box!
https://www2.familyhandyman.com/electrical/wiring-switches/how-to-wire-a-threeway-switch/view-all
answered 2 hours ago
Larry BirtLarry Birt
663
First of all, id the related light controlled from more than one location? If so, check this out (any time the white wire is used as hot it should be wrapped with black tape inside the box!
https://www2.familyhandyman.com/electrical/wiring-switches/how-to-wire-a-threeway-switch/view-all
answered 2 hours ago
Larry BirtLarry Birt
663
answered 2 hours ago
Larry BirtLarry Birt
663
answered 2 hours ago
Larry BirtLarry Birt
663
answered 2 hours ago
Larry BirtLarry Birt
663
663
This is interesting, but doesn't answer the original question. Please take our tour so you'll know how better to contribute here.
– Daniel Griscom
17 mins ago
add a comment |
This is interesting, but doesn't answer the original question. Please take our tour so you'll know how better to contribute here.
– Daniel Griscom
17 mins ago
This is interesting, but doesn't answer the original question. Please take our tour so you'll know how better to contribute here.
– Daniel Griscom
17 mins ago
This is interesting, but doesn't answer the original question. Please take our tour so you'll know how better to contribute here.
– Daniel Griscom
17 mins ago
add a comment |
Thanks for contributing an answer to Home Improvement Stack Exchange!
- Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!
But avoid …
- Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.
- Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.
To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function ()
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fdiy.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f164964%2fsafety-when-modifying-old-electrical-work%23new-answer', 'question_page');
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
2
Learn what a switch loop is. That probably won't be the only one you find. diy.stackexchange.com/questions/31700/…
– Ecnerwal
3 hours ago
2
In short, it will not be unusual to find that many of your switch locations will not support a smart switch without rewiring the building, as they will not have ANY neutral conductor provided. That was the way it was done for a long time, and it was code until 2011. They should be re-marked black or red, but they often are not in practice, or it wasn't very permanent after all.
– Ecnerwal
3 hours ago