What does どうかと思う mean?How can we understand and translate はず used with facts of known truth?ず negative verbは topic particle. What does it mean?Chaining sentences, and past formのもさーこう, イロイロ and other considerationsIf から can work as an informal emphatic particle, so can ので?だって, なんだって and some other interpretation questionsTranslating ちょっとそこまではStill learning Japanese and I need help with this phrase “誰が止めるというの 心が叫んだ声を”What does “なぜって‥‥‥ それは おかあさんには ないしょなの” mean?

How to compare two different formulations of a problem?

Why don't electrons take the shorter path in coils

If all stars rotate, why was there a theory developed, that requires non-rotating stars?

Did the British navy fail to take into account the ballistics correction due to Coriolis force during WW1 Falkland Islands battle?

Check in to 2 hotels at same location

Patching SQL Server 2014 Versus SQL Server 2014 Express

Three Singles in Three Clubs

Is it possible to create a golf ball sized star?

Vacuum collapse -- why do strong metals implode but glass doesn't?

Ask for a paid taxi in order to arrive as early as possible for an interview within the city

How to write triplets in 4/4 time without using a 3 on top of the notes all the time

Is it appropriate for a prospective landlord to ask me for my credit report?

Would it be possible to have a GMO that produces chocolate?

Why didn’t Doctor Strange stay in the original winning timeline?

On the feasibility of space battleships

How to stop this icon from appearing on the taskbar?

Nth Problem with TikZ and Extensive Form Games

When translating the law, who ensures that the wording does not change the meaning of the law?

If the first law of thermodynamics ensures conservation of energy, why does it allow systems to lose energy?

What does it mean to have a subnet mask /32?

Brexit and backstop: would changes require unanimous approval by all EU countries? Does Ireland hold a veto?

Why were movies shot on film shot at 24 frames per second?

Bankers with rancor

Why aren't RCS openings an issue for spacecraft heat shields?



What does どうかと思う mean?


How can we understand and translate はず used with facts of known truth?ず negative verbは topic particle. What does it mean?Chaining sentences, and past formのもさーこう, イロイロ and other considerationsIf から can work as an informal emphatic particle, so can ので?だって, なんだって and some other interpretation questionsTranslating ちょっとそこまではStill learning Japanese and I need help with this phrase “誰が止めるというの 心が叫んだ声を”What does “なぜって‥‥‥ それは おかあさんには ないしょなの” mean?






.everyoneloves__top-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__mid-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__bot-mid-leaderboard:empty margin-bottom:0;








2















I can't seem to get a good grasp of it. I found a few example sentences and read on weblio that it means: to think (something) is improper; to question; to have a problem with.

From the sentences I read, most of them were translated as "I doubt that..." or "I'm not sure about that".


There is this line that I found in a manga, with 2 boys having a banter:

A says: 死ね。

B replies: すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと思う~☆ (yes his line has those symbols, which I can only think that he has a playful tone and is mocking A)



"I doubt that I will drop dead right away"/ " Die quickly? I'm not so sure about that"
Do these translations make sense?










share|improve this question






























    2















    I can't seem to get a good grasp of it. I found a few example sentences and read on weblio that it means: to think (something) is improper; to question; to have a problem with.

    From the sentences I read, most of them were translated as "I doubt that..." or "I'm not sure about that".


    There is this line that I found in a manga, with 2 boys having a banter:

    A says: 死ね。

    B replies: すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと思う~☆ (yes his line has those symbols, which I can only think that he has a playful tone and is mocking A)



    "I doubt that I will drop dead right away"/ " Die quickly? I'm not so sure about that"
    Do these translations make sense?










    share|improve this question


























      2












      2








      2








      I can't seem to get a good grasp of it. I found a few example sentences and read on weblio that it means: to think (something) is improper; to question; to have a problem with.

      From the sentences I read, most of them were translated as "I doubt that..." or "I'm not sure about that".


      There is this line that I found in a manga, with 2 boys having a banter:

      A says: 死ね。

      B replies: すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと思う~☆ (yes his line has those symbols, which I can only think that he has a playful tone and is mocking A)



      "I doubt that I will drop dead right away"/ " Die quickly? I'm not so sure about that"
      Do these translations make sense?










      share|improve this question














      I can't seem to get a good grasp of it. I found a few example sentences and read on weblio that it means: to think (something) is improper; to question; to have a problem with.

      From the sentences I read, most of them were translated as "I doubt that..." or "I'm not sure about that".


      There is this line that I found in a manga, with 2 boys having a banter:

      A says: 死ね。

      B replies: すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと思う~☆ (yes his line has those symbols, which I can only think that he has a playful tone and is mocking A)



      "I doubt that I will drop dead right away"/ " Die quickly? I'm not so sure about that"
      Do these translations make sense?







      grammar translation






      share|improve this question













      share|improve this question











      share|improve this question




      share|improve this question










      asked 9 hours ago









      Alice B. RabbitAlice B. Rabbit

      4693 silver badges10 bronze badges




      4693 silver badges10 bronze badges























          2 Answers
          2






          active

          oldest

          votes


















          5













          「どうかと思う」 is a roundabout and indirect way of expressing one's somewhat negative opinion or impression of an action, situation, tendency, etc.



          It is indirect for using the word 「どうか」 ("how is it") instead of directly saying "I don't like it.", "I think it's bad.", etc.



          A more direct version of 「どうかと思う」 would be 「あまり感心かんしんしない」 ("I am not so impressed.") and that would be one way to translate 「どうかと思う」.



          Other possible translations would include:



          "I kinda wonder about ~~."



          "I don't think it's so good."



          "I find it less than ideal."



          Whatever fits the best in the target language is the best translation. One will not arrive at it just by staring at the phrase 「どうかと思う」 as it is not a direct expression.



          Finally,




          A says: 死ね。



          B replies: すぐ死ねって言うどうかと思う~☆



          "I doubt that I will drop dead right away"/ " Die quickly? I'm not so sure about that" Do these translations make sense?




          For a translation, that is O.K. because translation is an art, but if you really want to understand B's line, it is said about the fact that A said what he said facilely. The 「の」 in 「言うの」 is a nominalizer.



          The 「どうかと思う」 is said about A's way of speaking, which uses a serious phrase like 「死ね」 too easily. It is not said about whether B will actually die soon.






          share|improve this answer



























          • It's hard to convey how each word of the idiom make up its global meaning through translation, but building on your suggestions I personally find that I find <subject> questionable / dubious does quite a good job at it by keeping a close similarity in the literal translation of both the whole expression and each of its components (find ~= 思う ; questionable / dubious ~= どうか). Of course it's a poor translation, but may help get the feeling of it.

            – desseim
            6 hours ago







          • 1





            @lélecteur thank you for the in-depth explanation! I can understand better now. I had no idea that it could be close to あまり感心しない.<br>

            – Alice B. Rabbit
            6 hours ago











          • @desseim thank you for the input as well. It's the first time seeing this structure and I wasn't sure how to translate it. I found some synonyms but it was still a bit hard to convey.

            – Alice B. Rabbit
            6 hours ago











          • @AliceB.Rabbit I wanted to add a few more ways to decompose its components and look at it so I eventually put them in a separate answer. Doesn't mean there's anything wrong with this answer, it is absolutely correct, but it may help you get a bit more of the feeling behind this idiom. I find it surprisingly hard to find a literal equivalent in English that would be both accurate and self-explanatory.

            – desseim
            5 hours ago


















          0













          どう can, colloquially, be used to express one's opinion of a thing being "questionable", or "dubious", without outwardly nor directly criticizing it either.
          It takes this meaning when used more "affirmatively" in the sentence, a bit like interrogative words may take a critical meaning when put in rethorical questions in a language like English.



          In other words, akin to how What do you say ? asks a genuine interrogation while What do you think you're saying ? indirectly states a reproach, どういうことですか?
          ("What's this") most likely asks what something is while どういうことなんだよ! can express critical bewilderment ("What the **** is this !?").



          Similarly, people will often utter どうかな to express (inwardly) doubt about the validity / reasonability / etc of something. When expressed outwardly, ○○どうかな can become for example ○○どうかよ! to prompt someone to reflect on the validity / ethics / etc of ○○.



          So in your example, すぐ死ねって言うこと is what's being questioned by the speaker. You could replace the sentence by すぐ死ねって言うのどうかよ or すぐ死ねって言うのどうなんだよ and it'll be a harsh reproach of "instantly saying 'die!'". すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと思う or even more explicitly すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと個人的に思う / すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと個人的に思うけど / etc instead conveys the speaker's mixed feelings about "instantly saying 'die!'" in a more indirect thus soft and gentle way.



          Eventually the use ~☆ hints that he|she is making his criticism as lightweight and indecisive as possible. I'd wager he|she doesn't mind it much eventually, is just lightheartedly bantering, or is quite afraid of and cautious not to ire the person who said "死ね。" for example.




          I'm not sure what to think about instantly saying 'die' ;)



          What's up with that immediately saying 'die' :/




          for example would sound like legitimate translations to me, especially tone-wise.




          To be clear, the 大辞泉 lists up "having doubts, not being sure" and "finding it odd, distancing oneself with" as 2 separate definitions for どうか.
          My above explanation mixes these two, as I think the root feeling is basically the same, and I hoped for it to rather give a intuitive grasp or "gut feeling" of what the idiom can express, generally, than restricted definitions or translations.






          share|improve this answer






















          • 1





            「(~~の/~~って)どうかよ!」とは言わないですね。。

            – Chocolate
            3 hours ago














          Your Answer








          StackExchange.ready(function()
          var channelOptions =
          tags: "".split(" "),
          id: "257"
          ;
          initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);

          StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function()
          // Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
          if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled)
          StackExchange.using("snippets", function()
          createEditor();
          );

          else
          createEditor();

          );

          function createEditor()
          StackExchange.prepareEditor(
          heartbeatType: 'answer',
          autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
          convertImagesToLinks: false,
          noModals: true,
          showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
          reputationToPostImages: null,
          bindNavPrevention: true,
          postfix: "",
          imageUploader:
          brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
          contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
          allowUrls: true
          ,
          noCode: true, onDemand: true,
          discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
          ,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
          );



          );













          draft saved

          draft discarded


















          StackExchange.ready(
          function ()
          StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fjapanese.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f70250%2fwhat-does-%25e3%2581%25a9%25e3%2581%2586%25e3%2581%258b%25e3%2581%25a8%25e6%2580%259d%25e3%2581%2586-mean%23new-answer', 'question_page');

          );

          Post as a guest















          Required, but never shown

























          2 Answers
          2






          active

          oldest

          votes








          2 Answers
          2






          active

          oldest

          votes









          active

          oldest

          votes






          active

          oldest

          votes









          5













          「どうかと思う」 is a roundabout and indirect way of expressing one's somewhat negative opinion or impression of an action, situation, tendency, etc.



          It is indirect for using the word 「どうか」 ("how is it") instead of directly saying "I don't like it.", "I think it's bad.", etc.



          A more direct version of 「どうかと思う」 would be 「あまり感心かんしんしない」 ("I am not so impressed.") and that would be one way to translate 「どうかと思う」.



          Other possible translations would include:



          "I kinda wonder about ~~."



          "I don't think it's so good."



          "I find it less than ideal."



          Whatever fits the best in the target language is the best translation. One will not arrive at it just by staring at the phrase 「どうかと思う」 as it is not a direct expression.



          Finally,




          A says: 死ね。



          B replies: すぐ死ねって言うどうかと思う~☆



          "I doubt that I will drop dead right away"/ " Die quickly? I'm not so sure about that" Do these translations make sense?




          For a translation, that is O.K. because translation is an art, but if you really want to understand B's line, it is said about the fact that A said what he said facilely. The 「の」 in 「言うの」 is a nominalizer.



          The 「どうかと思う」 is said about A's way of speaking, which uses a serious phrase like 「死ね」 too easily. It is not said about whether B will actually die soon.






          share|improve this answer



























          • It's hard to convey how each word of the idiom make up its global meaning through translation, but building on your suggestions I personally find that I find <subject> questionable / dubious does quite a good job at it by keeping a close similarity in the literal translation of both the whole expression and each of its components (find ~= 思う ; questionable / dubious ~= どうか). Of course it's a poor translation, but may help get the feeling of it.

            – desseim
            6 hours ago







          • 1





            @lélecteur thank you for the in-depth explanation! I can understand better now. I had no idea that it could be close to あまり感心しない.<br>

            – Alice B. Rabbit
            6 hours ago











          • @desseim thank you for the input as well. It's the first time seeing this structure and I wasn't sure how to translate it. I found some synonyms but it was still a bit hard to convey.

            – Alice B. Rabbit
            6 hours ago











          • @AliceB.Rabbit I wanted to add a few more ways to decompose its components and look at it so I eventually put them in a separate answer. Doesn't mean there's anything wrong with this answer, it is absolutely correct, but it may help you get a bit more of the feeling behind this idiom. I find it surprisingly hard to find a literal equivalent in English that would be both accurate and self-explanatory.

            – desseim
            5 hours ago















          5













          「どうかと思う」 is a roundabout and indirect way of expressing one's somewhat negative opinion or impression of an action, situation, tendency, etc.



          It is indirect for using the word 「どうか」 ("how is it") instead of directly saying "I don't like it.", "I think it's bad.", etc.



          A more direct version of 「どうかと思う」 would be 「あまり感心かんしんしない」 ("I am not so impressed.") and that would be one way to translate 「どうかと思う」.



          Other possible translations would include:



          "I kinda wonder about ~~."



          "I don't think it's so good."



          "I find it less than ideal."



          Whatever fits the best in the target language is the best translation. One will not arrive at it just by staring at the phrase 「どうかと思う」 as it is not a direct expression.



          Finally,




          A says: 死ね。



          B replies: すぐ死ねって言うどうかと思う~☆



          "I doubt that I will drop dead right away"/ " Die quickly? I'm not so sure about that" Do these translations make sense?




          For a translation, that is O.K. because translation is an art, but if you really want to understand B's line, it is said about the fact that A said what he said facilely. The 「の」 in 「言うの」 is a nominalizer.



          The 「どうかと思う」 is said about A's way of speaking, which uses a serious phrase like 「死ね」 too easily. It is not said about whether B will actually die soon.






          share|improve this answer



























          • It's hard to convey how each word of the idiom make up its global meaning through translation, but building on your suggestions I personally find that I find <subject> questionable / dubious does quite a good job at it by keeping a close similarity in the literal translation of both the whole expression and each of its components (find ~= 思う ; questionable / dubious ~= どうか). Of course it's a poor translation, but may help get the feeling of it.

            – desseim
            6 hours ago







          • 1





            @lélecteur thank you for the in-depth explanation! I can understand better now. I had no idea that it could be close to あまり感心しない.<br>

            – Alice B. Rabbit
            6 hours ago











          • @desseim thank you for the input as well. It's the first time seeing this structure and I wasn't sure how to translate it. I found some synonyms but it was still a bit hard to convey.

            – Alice B. Rabbit
            6 hours ago











          • @AliceB.Rabbit I wanted to add a few more ways to decompose its components and look at it so I eventually put them in a separate answer. Doesn't mean there's anything wrong with this answer, it is absolutely correct, but it may help you get a bit more of the feeling behind this idiom. I find it surprisingly hard to find a literal equivalent in English that would be both accurate and self-explanatory.

            – desseim
            5 hours ago













          5












          5








          5







          「どうかと思う」 is a roundabout and indirect way of expressing one's somewhat negative opinion or impression of an action, situation, tendency, etc.



          It is indirect for using the word 「どうか」 ("how is it") instead of directly saying "I don't like it.", "I think it's bad.", etc.



          A more direct version of 「どうかと思う」 would be 「あまり感心かんしんしない」 ("I am not so impressed.") and that would be one way to translate 「どうかと思う」.



          Other possible translations would include:



          "I kinda wonder about ~~."



          "I don't think it's so good."



          "I find it less than ideal."



          Whatever fits the best in the target language is the best translation. One will not arrive at it just by staring at the phrase 「どうかと思う」 as it is not a direct expression.



          Finally,




          A says: 死ね。



          B replies: すぐ死ねって言うどうかと思う~☆



          "I doubt that I will drop dead right away"/ " Die quickly? I'm not so sure about that" Do these translations make sense?




          For a translation, that is O.K. because translation is an art, but if you really want to understand B's line, it is said about the fact that A said what he said facilely. The 「の」 in 「言うの」 is a nominalizer.



          The 「どうかと思う」 is said about A's way of speaking, which uses a serious phrase like 「死ね」 too easily. It is not said about whether B will actually die soon.






          share|improve this answer















          「どうかと思う」 is a roundabout and indirect way of expressing one's somewhat negative opinion or impression of an action, situation, tendency, etc.



          It is indirect for using the word 「どうか」 ("how is it") instead of directly saying "I don't like it.", "I think it's bad.", etc.



          A more direct version of 「どうかと思う」 would be 「あまり感心かんしんしない」 ("I am not so impressed.") and that would be one way to translate 「どうかと思う」.



          Other possible translations would include:



          "I kinda wonder about ~~."



          "I don't think it's so good."



          "I find it less than ideal."



          Whatever fits the best in the target language is the best translation. One will not arrive at it just by staring at the phrase 「どうかと思う」 as it is not a direct expression.



          Finally,




          A says: 死ね。



          B replies: すぐ死ねって言うどうかと思う~☆



          "I doubt that I will drop dead right away"/ " Die quickly? I'm not so sure about that" Do these translations make sense?




          For a translation, that is O.K. because translation is an art, but if you really want to understand B's line, it is said about the fact that A said what he said facilely. The 「の」 in 「言うの」 is a nominalizer.



          The 「どうかと思う」 is said about A's way of speaking, which uses a serious phrase like 「死ね」 too easily. It is not said about whether B will actually die soon.







          share|improve this answer














          share|improve this answer



          share|improve this answer








          edited 6 hours ago

























          answered 7 hours ago









          l'électeurl'électeur

          136k9 gold badges182 silver badges298 bronze badges




          136k9 gold badges182 silver badges298 bronze badges















          • It's hard to convey how each word of the idiom make up its global meaning through translation, but building on your suggestions I personally find that I find <subject> questionable / dubious does quite a good job at it by keeping a close similarity in the literal translation of both the whole expression and each of its components (find ~= 思う ; questionable / dubious ~= どうか). Of course it's a poor translation, but may help get the feeling of it.

            – desseim
            6 hours ago







          • 1





            @lélecteur thank you for the in-depth explanation! I can understand better now. I had no idea that it could be close to あまり感心しない.<br>

            – Alice B. Rabbit
            6 hours ago











          • @desseim thank you for the input as well. It's the first time seeing this structure and I wasn't sure how to translate it. I found some synonyms but it was still a bit hard to convey.

            – Alice B. Rabbit
            6 hours ago











          • @AliceB.Rabbit I wanted to add a few more ways to decompose its components and look at it so I eventually put them in a separate answer. Doesn't mean there's anything wrong with this answer, it is absolutely correct, but it may help you get a bit more of the feeling behind this idiom. I find it surprisingly hard to find a literal equivalent in English that would be both accurate and self-explanatory.

            – desseim
            5 hours ago

















          • It's hard to convey how each word of the idiom make up its global meaning through translation, but building on your suggestions I personally find that I find <subject> questionable / dubious does quite a good job at it by keeping a close similarity in the literal translation of both the whole expression and each of its components (find ~= 思う ; questionable / dubious ~= どうか). Of course it's a poor translation, but may help get the feeling of it.

            – desseim
            6 hours ago







          • 1





            @lélecteur thank you for the in-depth explanation! I can understand better now. I had no idea that it could be close to あまり感心しない.<br>

            – Alice B. Rabbit
            6 hours ago











          • @desseim thank you for the input as well. It's the first time seeing this structure and I wasn't sure how to translate it. I found some synonyms but it was still a bit hard to convey.

            – Alice B. Rabbit
            6 hours ago











          • @AliceB.Rabbit I wanted to add a few more ways to decompose its components and look at it so I eventually put them in a separate answer. Doesn't mean there's anything wrong with this answer, it is absolutely correct, but it may help you get a bit more of the feeling behind this idiom. I find it surprisingly hard to find a literal equivalent in English that would be both accurate and self-explanatory.

            – desseim
            5 hours ago
















          It's hard to convey how each word of the idiom make up its global meaning through translation, but building on your suggestions I personally find that I find <subject> questionable / dubious does quite a good job at it by keeping a close similarity in the literal translation of both the whole expression and each of its components (find ~= 思う ; questionable / dubious ~= どうか). Of course it's a poor translation, but may help get the feeling of it.

          – desseim
          6 hours ago






          It's hard to convey how each word of the idiom make up its global meaning through translation, but building on your suggestions I personally find that I find <subject> questionable / dubious does quite a good job at it by keeping a close similarity in the literal translation of both the whole expression and each of its components (find ~= 思う ; questionable / dubious ~= どうか). Of course it's a poor translation, but may help get the feeling of it.

          – desseim
          6 hours ago





          1




          1





          @lélecteur thank you for the in-depth explanation! I can understand better now. I had no idea that it could be close to あまり感心しない.<br>

          – Alice B. Rabbit
          6 hours ago





          @lélecteur thank you for the in-depth explanation! I can understand better now. I had no idea that it could be close to あまり感心しない.<br>

          – Alice B. Rabbit
          6 hours ago













          @desseim thank you for the input as well. It's the first time seeing this structure and I wasn't sure how to translate it. I found some synonyms but it was still a bit hard to convey.

          – Alice B. Rabbit
          6 hours ago





          @desseim thank you for the input as well. It's the first time seeing this structure and I wasn't sure how to translate it. I found some synonyms but it was still a bit hard to convey.

          – Alice B. Rabbit
          6 hours ago













          @AliceB.Rabbit I wanted to add a few more ways to decompose its components and look at it so I eventually put them in a separate answer. Doesn't mean there's anything wrong with this answer, it is absolutely correct, but it may help you get a bit more of the feeling behind this idiom. I find it surprisingly hard to find a literal equivalent in English that would be both accurate and self-explanatory.

          – desseim
          5 hours ago





          @AliceB.Rabbit I wanted to add a few more ways to decompose its components and look at it so I eventually put them in a separate answer. Doesn't mean there's anything wrong with this answer, it is absolutely correct, but it may help you get a bit more of the feeling behind this idiom. I find it surprisingly hard to find a literal equivalent in English that would be both accurate and self-explanatory.

          – desseim
          5 hours ago













          0













          どう can, colloquially, be used to express one's opinion of a thing being "questionable", or "dubious", without outwardly nor directly criticizing it either.
          It takes this meaning when used more "affirmatively" in the sentence, a bit like interrogative words may take a critical meaning when put in rethorical questions in a language like English.



          In other words, akin to how What do you say ? asks a genuine interrogation while What do you think you're saying ? indirectly states a reproach, どういうことですか?
          ("What's this") most likely asks what something is while どういうことなんだよ! can express critical bewilderment ("What the **** is this !?").



          Similarly, people will often utter どうかな to express (inwardly) doubt about the validity / reasonability / etc of something. When expressed outwardly, ○○どうかな can become for example ○○どうかよ! to prompt someone to reflect on the validity / ethics / etc of ○○.



          So in your example, すぐ死ねって言うこと is what's being questioned by the speaker. You could replace the sentence by すぐ死ねって言うのどうかよ or すぐ死ねって言うのどうなんだよ and it'll be a harsh reproach of "instantly saying 'die!'". すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと思う or even more explicitly すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと個人的に思う / すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと個人的に思うけど / etc instead conveys the speaker's mixed feelings about "instantly saying 'die!'" in a more indirect thus soft and gentle way.



          Eventually the use ~☆ hints that he|she is making his criticism as lightweight and indecisive as possible. I'd wager he|she doesn't mind it much eventually, is just lightheartedly bantering, or is quite afraid of and cautious not to ire the person who said "死ね。" for example.




          I'm not sure what to think about instantly saying 'die' ;)



          What's up with that immediately saying 'die' :/




          for example would sound like legitimate translations to me, especially tone-wise.




          To be clear, the 大辞泉 lists up "having doubts, not being sure" and "finding it odd, distancing oneself with" as 2 separate definitions for どうか.
          My above explanation mixes these two, as I think the root feeling is basically the same, and I hoped for it to rather give a intuitive grasp or "gut feeling" of what the idiom can express, generally, than restricted definitions or translations.






          share|improve this answer






















          • 1





            「(~~の/~~って)どうかよ!」とは言わないですね。。

            – Chocolate
            3 hours ago
















          0













          どう can, colloquially, be used to express one's opinion of a thing being "questionable", or "dubious", without outwardly nor directly criticizing it either.
          It takes this meaning when used more "affirmatively" in the sentence, a bit like interrogative words may take a critical meaning when put in rethorical questions in a language like English.



          In other words, akin to how What do you say ? asks a genuine interrogation while What do you think you're saying ? indirectly states a reproach, どういうことですか?
          ("What's this") most likely asks what something is while どういうことなんだよ! can express critical bewilderment ("What the **** is this !?").



          Similarly, people will often utter どうかな to express (inwardly) doubt about the validity / reasonability / etc of something. When expressed outwardly, ○○どうかな can become for example ○○どうかよ! to prompt someone to reflect on the validity / ethics / etc of ○○.



          So in your example, すぐ死ねって言うこと is what's being questioned by the speaker. You could replace the sentence by すぐ死ねって言うのどうかよ or すぐ死ねって言うのどうなんだよ and it'll be a harsh reproach of "instantly saying 'die!'". すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと思う or even more explicitly すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと個人的に思う / すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと個人的に思うけど / etc instead conveys the speaker's mixed feelings about "instantly saying 'die!'" in a more indirect thus soft and gentle way.



          Eventually the use ~☆ hints that he|she is making his criticism as lightweight and indecisive as possible. I'd wager he|she doesn't mind it much eventually, is just lightheartedly bantering, or is quite afraid of and cautious not to ire the person who said "死ね。" for example.




          I'm not sure what to think about instantly saying 'die' ;)



          What's up with that immediately saying 'die' :/




          for example would sound like legitimate translations to me, especially tone-wise.




          To be clear, the 大辞泉 lists up "having doubts, not being sure" and "finding it odd, distancing oneself with" as 2 separate definitions for どうか.
          My above explanation mixes these two, as I think the root feeling is basically the same, and I hoped for it to rather give a intuitive grasp or "gut feeling" of what the idiom can express, generally, than restricted definitions or translations.






          share|improve this answer






















          • 1





            「(~~の/~~って)どうかよ!」とは言わないですね。。

            – Chocolate
            3 hours ago














          0












          0








          0







          どう can, colloquially, be used to express one's opinion of a thing being "questionable", or "dubious", without outwardly nor directly criticizing it either.
          It takes this meaning when used more "affirmatively" in the sentence, a bit like interrogative words may take a critical meaning when put in rethorical questions in a language like English.



          In other words, akin to how What do you say ? asks a genuine interrogation while What do you think you're saying ? indirectly states a reproach, どういうことですか?
          ("What's this") most likely asks what something is while どういうことなんだよ! can express critical bewilderment ("What the **** is this !?").



          Similarly, people will often utter どうかな to express (inwardly) doubt about the validity / reasonability / etc of something. When expressed outwardly, ○○どうかな can become for example ○○どうかよ! to prompt someone to reflect on the validity / ethics / etc of ○○.



          So in your example, すぐ死ねって言うこと is what's being questioned by the speaker. You could replace the sentence by すぐ死ねって言うのどうかよ or すぐ死ねって言うのどうなんだよ and it'll be a harsh reproach of "instantly saying 'die!'". すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと思う or even more explicitly すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと個人的に思う / すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと個人的に思うけど / etc instead conveys the speaker's mixed feelings about "instantly saying 'die!'" in a more indirect thus soft and gentle way.



          Eventually the use ~☆ hints that he|she is making his criticism as lightweight and indecisive as possible. I'd wager he|she doesn't mind it much eventually, is just lightheartedly bantering, or is quite afraid of and cautious not to ire the person who said "死ね。" for example.




          I'm not sure what to think about instantly saying 'die' ;)



          What's up with that immediately saying 'die' :/




          for example would sound like legitimate translations to me, especially tone-wise.




          To be clear, the 大辞泉 lists up "having doubts, not being sure" and "finding it odd, distancing oneself with" as 2 separate definitions for どうか.
          My above explanation mixes these two, as I think the root feeling is basically the same, and I hoped for it to rather give a intuitive grasp or "gut feeling" of what the idiom can express, generally, than restricted definitions or translations.






          share|improve this answer















          どう can, colloquially, be used to express one's opinion of a thing being "questionable", or "dubious", without outwardly nor directly criticizing it either.
          It takes this meaning when used more "affirmatively" in the sentence, a bit like interrogative words may take a critical meaning when put in rethorical questions in a language like English.



          In other words, akin to how What do you say ? asks a genuine interrogation while What do you think you're saying ? indirectly states a reproach, どういうことですか?
          ("What's this") most likely asks what something is while どういうことなんだよ! can express critical bewilderment ("What the **** is this !?").



          Similarly, people will often utter どうかな to express (inwardly) doubt about the validity / reasonability / etc of something. When expressed outwardly, ○○どうかな can become for example ○○どうかよ! to prompt someone to reflect on the validity / ethics / etc of ○○.



          So in your example, すぐ死ねって言うこと is what's being questioned by the speaker. You could replace the sentence by すぐ死ねって言うのどうかよ or すぐ死ねって言うのどうなんだよ and it'll be a harsh reproach of "instantly saying 'die!'". すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと思う or even more explicitly すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと個人的に思う / すぐ死ねって言うのどうかと個人的に思うけど / etc instead conveys the speaker's mixed feelings about "instantly saying 'die!'" in a more indirect thus soft and gentle way.



          Eventually the use ~☆ hints that he|she is making his criticism as lightweight and indecisive as possible. I'd wager he|she doesn't mind it much eventually, is just lightheartedly bantering, or is quite afraid of and cautious not to ire the person who said "死ね。" for example.




          I'm not sure what to think about instantly saying 'die' ;)



          What's up with that immediately saying 'die' :/




          for example would sound like legitimate translations to me, especially tone-wise.




          To be clear, the 大辞泉 lists up "having doubts, not being sure" and "finding it odd, distancing oneself with" as 2 separate definitions for どうか.
          My above explanation mixes these two, as I think the root feeling is basically the same, and I hoped for it to rather give a intuitive grasp or "gut feeling" of what the idiom can express, generally, than restricted definitions or translations.







          share|improve this answer














          share|improve this answer



          share|improve this answer








          edited 4 hours ago

























          answered 5 hours ago









          desseimdesseim

          5922 silver badges7 bronze badges




          5922 silver badges7 bronze badges










          • 1





            「(~~の/~~って)どうかよ!」とは言わないですね。。

            – Chocolate
            3 hours ago













          • 1





            「(~~の/~~って)どうかよ!」とは言わないですね。。

            – Chocolate
            3 hours ago








          1




          1





          「(~~の/~~って)どうかよ!」とは言わないですね。。

          – Chocolate
          3 hours ago






          「(~~の/~~って)どうかよ!」とは言わないですね。。

          – Chocolate
          3 hours ago


















          draft saved

          draft discarded
















































          Thanks for contributing an answer to Japanese Language Stack Exchange!


          • Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!

          But avoid


          • Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.

          • Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.

          To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.




          draft saved


          draft discarded














          StackExchange.ready(
          function ()
          StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fjapanese.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f70250%2fwhat-does-%25e3%2581%25a9%25e3%2581%2586%25e3%2581%258b%25e3%2581%25a8%25e6%2580%259d%25e3%2581%2586-mean%23new-answer', 'question_page');

          );

          Post as a guest















          Required, but never shown





















































          Required, but never shown














          Required, but never shown












          Required, but never shown







          Required, but never shown

































          Required, but never shown














          Required, but never shown












          Required, but never shown







          Required, but never shown







          Popular posts from this blog

          Invision Community Contents History See also References External links Navigation menuProprietaryinvisioncommunity.comIPS Community ForumsIPS Community Forumsthis blog entry"License Changes, IP.Board 3.4, and the Future""Interview -- Matt Mecham of Ibforums""CEO Invision Power Board, Matt Mecham Is a Liar, Thief!"IPB License Explanation 1.3, 1.3.1, 2.0, and 2.1ArchivedSecurity Fixes, Updates And Enhancements For IPB 1.3.1Archived"New Demo Accounts - Invision Power Services"the original"New Default Skin"the original"Invision Power Board 3.0.0 and Applications Released"the original"Archived copy"the original"Perpetual licenses being done away with""Release Notes - Invision Power Services""Introducing: IPS Community Suite 4!"Invision Community Release Notes

          Canceling a color specificationRandomly assigning color to Graphics3D objects?Default color for Filling in Mathematica 9Coloring specific elements of sets with a prime modified order in an array plotHow to pick a color differing significantly from the colors already in a given color list?Detection of the text colorColor numbers based on their valueCan color schemes for use with ColorData include opacity specification?My dynamic color schemes

          Tom Holland Mục lục Đầu đời và giáo dục | Sự nghiệp | Cuộc sống cá nhân | Phim tham gia | Giải thưởng và đề cử | Chú thích | Liên kết ngoài | Trình đơn chuyển hướngProfile“Person Details for Thomas Stanley Holland, "England and Wales Birth Registration Index, 1837-2008" — FamilySearch.org”"Meet Tom Holland... the 16-year-old star of The Impossible""Schoolboy actor Tom Holland finds himself in Oscar contention for role in tsunami drama"“Naomi Watts on the Prince William and Harry's reaction to her film about the late Princess Diana”lưu trữ"Holland and Pflueger Are West End's Two New 'Billy Elliots'""I'm so envious of my son, the movie star! British writer Dominic Holland's spent 20 years trying to crack Hollywood - but he's been beaten to it by a very unlikely rival"“Richard and Margaret Povey of Jersey, Channel Islands, UK: Information about Thomas Stanley Holland”"Tom Holland to play Billy Elliot""New Billy Elliot leaving the garage"Billy Elliot the Musical - Tom Holland - Billy"A Tale of four Billys: Tom Holland""The Feel Good Factor""Thames Christian College schoolboys join Myleene Klass for The Feelgood Factor""Government launches £600,000 arts bursaries pilot""BILLY's Chapman, Holland, Gardner & Jackson-Keen Visit Prime Minister""Elton John 'blown away' by Billy Elliot fifth birthday" (video with John's interview and fragments of Holland's performance)"First News interviews Arrietty's Tom Holland"“33rd Critics' Circle Film Awards winners”“National Board of Review Current Awards”Bản gốc"Ron Howard Whaling Tale 'In The Heart Of The Sea' Casts Tom Holland"“'Spider-Man' Finds Tom Holland to Star as New Web-Slinger”lưu trữ“Captain America: Civil War (2016)”“Film Review: ‘Captain America: Civil War’”lưu trữ“‘Captain America: Civil War’ review: Choose your own avenger”lưu trữ“The Lost City of Z reviews”“Sony Pictures and Marvel Studios Find Their 'Spider-Man' Star and Director”“‘Mary Magdalene’, ‘Current War’ & ‘Wind River’ Get 2017 Release Dates From Weinstein”“Lionsgate Unleashing Daisy Ridley & Tom Holland Starrer ‘Chaos Walking’ In Cannes”“PTA's 'Master' Leads Chicago Film Critics Nominations, UPDATED: Houston and Indiana Critics Nominations”“Nominaciones Goya 2013 Telecinco Cinema – ENG”“Jameson Empire Film Awards: Martin Freeman wins best actor for performance in The Hobbit”“34th Annual Young Artist Awards”Bản gốc“Teen Choice Awards 2016—Captain America: Civil War Leads Second Wave of Nominations”“BAFTA Film Award Nominations: ‘La La Land’ Leads Race”“Saturn Awards Nominations 2017: 'Rogue One,' 'Walking Dead' Lead”Tom HollandTom HollandTom HollandTom Hollandmedia.gettyimages.comWorldCat Identities300279794no20130442900000 0004 0355 42791085670554170004732cb16706349t(data)XX5557367