How to Practice After Stream Entry as Opposed to Before?How does stream entry occur?Is stream entry an unmistakeable experience?Queen Mallika story and stream entryCan you attain stream entry without meditation?How common is stream entry?Does Zen have a concept similar to stream entry?Is stream entry in 20 or 30 years of practice realistic?Ego death and stream entry is it the same thing?How do Bodhisattva vow takers avoid stream entry?How to recognize stream entry?
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How to Practice After Stream Entry as Opposed to Before?
How does stream entry occur?Is stream entry an unmistakeable experience?Queen Mallika story and stream entryCan you attain stream entry without meditation?How common is stream entry?Does Zen have a concept similar to stream entry?Is stream entry in 20 or 30 years of practice realistic?Ego death and stream entry is it the same thing?How do Bodhisattva vow takers avoid stream entry?How to recognize stream entry?
I follow the notion that when the false view of an independent, permanent "self" is annihilated for the first time this is Stream Entry. The Dharma no long is merely a question mark, and it's not dependent on rituals, or merely following rules. These first three fetters can't continue in the face of such an experience.
But how is the practice after Stream Entry different that before?
"In Buddhism, a sotāpanna (Pali), śrotāpanna (Sanskrit; Chinese: 入流; pinyin: rùliú, Tibetan: རྒྱུན་ཞུགས་, Wylie: rgyun zhugs), "stream-winner", or "stream-entrant" is a person who has seen the Dharma and consequently, has dropped the first three fetters (saŋyojana) that bind a being to rebirth, namely self-view (sakkāya-ditthi), clinging to rites and rituals (sīlabbata-parāmāsa), and skeptical indecision (Vicikitsa).
The word sotāpanna literally means "one who entered (āpanna) the stream (sota)", after a metaphor which calls the noble eightfold path a stream which leads to nibbāna. Entering the stream (sotāpatti) is the first of the four stages of enlightenment."
-- Sotāpanna (wikipedia)
Also see Agataphala Mahānāma Sutta (A 6.10) -- The Discourse on Mahānāma (on the fruition-attainer)
personal-practice meditation-practicalities stream-entry fetters
add a comment |
I follow the notion that when the false view of an independent, permanent "self" is annihilated for the first time this is Stream Entry. The Dharma no long is merely a question mark, and it's not dependent on rituals, or merely following rules. These first three fetters can't continue in the face of such an experience.
But how is the practice after Stream Entry different that before?
"In Buddhism, a sotāpanna (Pali), śrotāpanna (Sanskrit; Chinese: 入流; pinyin: rùliú, Tibetan: རྒྱུན་ཞུགས་, Wylie: rgyun zhugs), "stream-winner", or "stream-entrant" is a person who has seen the Dharma and consequently, has dropped the first three fetters (saŋyojana) that bind a being to rebirth, namely self-view (sakkāya-ditthi), clinging to rites and rituals (sīlabbata-parāmāsa), and skeptical indecision (Vicikitsa).
The word sotāpanna literally means "one who entered (āpanna) the stream (sota)", after a metaphor which calls the noble eightfold path a stream which leads to nibbāna. Entering the stream (sotāpatti) is the first of the four stages of enlightenment."
-- Sotāpanna (wikipedia)
Also see Agataphala Mahānāma Sutta (A 6.10) -- The Discourse on Mahānāma (on the fruition-attainer)
personal-practice meditation-practicalities stream-entry fetters
Hi Eric! I asked a similar question a while ago on the DhammaWheel forum. You may like to take a look at it: dhammawheel.com/…
– Brian Díaz Flores
2 hours ago
add a comment |
I follow the notion that when the false view of an independent, permanent "self" is annihilated for the first time this is Stream Entry. The Dharma no long is merely a question mark, and it's not dependent on rituals, or merely following rules. These first three fetters can't continue in the face of such an experience.
But how is the practice after Stream Entry different that before?
"In Buddhism, a sotāpanna (Pali), śrotāpanna (Sanskrit; Chinese: 入流; pinyin: rùliú, Tibetan: རྒྱུན་ཞུགས་, Wylie: rgyun zhugs), "stream-winner", or "stream-entrant" is a person who has seen the Dharma and consequently, has dropped the first three fetters (saŋyojana) that bind a being to rebirth, namely self-view (sakkāya-ditthi), clinging to rites and rituals (sīlabbata-parāmāsa), and skeptical indecision (Vicikitsa).
The word sotāpanna literally means "one who entered (āpanna) the stream (sota)", after a metaphor which calls the noble eightfold path a stream which leads to nibbāna. Entering the stream (sotāpatti) is the first of the four stages of enlightenment."
-- Sotāpanna (wikipedia)
Also see Agataphala Mahānāma Sutta (A 6.10) -- The Discourse on Mahānāma (on the fruition-attainer)
personal-practice meditation-practicalities stream-entry fetters
I follow the notion that when the false view of an independent, permanent "self" is annihilated for the first time this is Stream Entry. The Dharma no long is merely a question mark, and it's not dependent on rituals, or merely following rules. These first three fetters can't continue in the face of such an experience.
But how is the practice after Stream Entry different that before?
"In Buddhism, a sotāpanna (Pali), śrotāpanna (Sanskrit; Chinese: 入流; pinyin: rùliú, Tibetan: རྒྱུན་ཞུགས་, Wylie: rgyun zhugs), "stream-winner", or "stream-entrant" is a person who has seen the Dharma and consequently, has dropped the first three fetters (saŋyojana) that bind a being to rebirth, namely self-view (sakkāya-ditthi), clinging to rites and rituals (sīlabbata-parāmāsa), and skeptical indecision (Vicikitsa).
The word sotāpanna literally means "one who entered (āpanna) the stream (sota)", after a metaphor which calls the noble eightfold path a stream which leads to nibbāna. Entering the stream (sotāpatti) is the first of the four stages of enlightenment."
-- Sotāpanna (wikipedia)
Also see Agataphala Mahānāma Sutta (A 6.10) -- The Discourse on Mahānāma (on the fruition-attainer)
personal-practice meditation-practicalities stream-entry fetters
personal-practice meditation-practicalities stream-entry fetters
edited 12 mins ago
ChrisW♦
31k42488
31k42488
asked 3 hours ago
brother ericbrother eric
75819
75819
Hi Eric! I asked a similar question a while ago on the DhammaWheel forum. You may like to take a look at it: dhammawheel.com/…
– Brian Díaz Flores
2 hours ago
add a comment |
Hi Eric! I asked a similar question a while ago on the DhammaWheel forum. You may like to take a look at it: dhammawheel.com/…
– Brian Díaz Flores
2 hours ago
Hi Eric! I asked a similar question a while ago on the DhammaWheel forum. You may like to take a look at it: dhammawheel.com/…
– Brian Díaz Flores
2 hours ago
Hi Eric! I asked a similar question a while ago on the DhammaWheel forum. You may like to take a look at it: dhammawheel.com/…
– Brian Díaz Flores
2 hours ago
add a comment |
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
Not different. If one wishes, one has to do an effort to turn the Wheel of Dhamma, develop the eightfold Path, as before.
One who has reached such stage knows this, having lost all doubts in regard of the path.
New contributor
add a comment |
"Stream-entry" requires three fetters to be cut, which include the fetter of doubt about the path and the fetter of identity-view.
Also, the Pali suttas define the both "sakkāya" (sat + kāya; "existent body/group" or "identity") & dukkha and the arising of identity & dukkha the same way, namely:
Pañca upādānakkhandhā sakkāyo. These five grasped aggregates are identity. MN 44
Saṃkhittena pañcupādānakkhandhā dukkhā. In brief, the five grasped aggregates are suffering. SN 56.11
The craving that makes for further becoming — accompanied by passion & delight, relishing now here & now there — i.e., craving for sensual
pleasure, craving for becoming, craving for non-becoming: This is the
origination of self-identification. MN 44
Now this is the noble truth of the origin of suffering. The craving that makes for further becoming — accompanied by passion & delight,
relishing now here & now there — i.e., craving for sensual pleasure,
craving for becoming, craving for non-becoming. SN 56.11
"Sakkāyadiṭṭhi" is to regard/view the five aggregates as "self", as follows:
How does identity view come about?
Kathaṃ sakkāyadiṭṭhi hotī
It’s when an uneducated ordinary person has not seen the noble ones, and is neither skilled nor trained in the teaching of the noble ones.
They’ve not seen good persons, and are neither skilled nor trained in
the teaching of the good persons.
They regard form as self, self as having form, form in self, or self in form.
They regard feeling … perception … choices … consciousness as self, self as having consciousness, consciousness in self, or self in
consciousness.
That’s how identity view comes about.
Evaṃ kho, āvuso visākha, sakkāyadiṭṭhi hotī
MN 44
It follows, for stream-entry to occur, two experiences must occur, namely:
Seeing clearly "identity" is not a real permanently existent thing, which cuts the fetter of identity-view.
Seeing clearly the ending of attachment to the aggregates (sakkaya) and the ending of identity view (sakkaya ditthi) ends dukkha, which cuts the fetter of doubt about the path.
Therefore, at stream-entry, it is known without any doubt that "non-attachment" towards the five aggregates is the Path to Nibbana. Thus, whatever phenomena or experiences occur, such as "jhana", these experiences/phenomena are not attached to or regarded as being or connected to "self".
If the ending of identity is experienced (such as by Sam Harris when taking LSD) but the correlated insight into the ending of dukkha is not experienced & maintained (such as by Sam Harris who, when not on drugs, promotes war & nuclear genocide) then stream-entry has not been attained.
"Doubt" is not doubt about "anatta" ("not-self') but is doubt about "anatta ending dukkha". This is how fake gurus & fake dharma are known; when deeds do not equate to claimed realisations. When the fetter of "sakkaya ditthi" is cut, so are myriad unwholesome selfish deeds; because it is discerned abandoning "sakkaya" results in peace (Nibbana).
add a comment |
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2 Answers
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2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
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votes
Not different. If one wishes, one has to do an effort to turn the Wheel of Dhamma, develop the eightfold Path, as before.
One who has reached such stage knows this, having lost all doubts in regard of the path.
New contributor
add a comment |
Not different. If one wishes, one has to do an effort to turn the Wheel of Dhamma, develop the eightfold Path, as before.
One who has reached such stage knows this, having lost all doubts in regard of the path.
New contributor
add a comment |
Not different. If one wishes, one has to do an effort to turn the Wheel of Dhamma, develop the eightfold Path, as before.
One who has reached such stage knows this, having lost all doubts in regard of the path.
New contributor
Not different. If one wishes, one has to do an effort to turn the Wheel of Dhamma, develop the eightfold Path, as before.
One who has reached such stage knows this, having lost all doubts in regard of the path.
New contributor
New contributor
answered 3 hours ago
Samana JohannSamana Johann
111
111
New contributor
New contributor
add a comment |
add a comment |
"Stream-entry" requires three fetters to be cut, which include the fetter of doubt about the path and the fetter of identity-view.
Also, the Pali suttas define the both "sakkāya" (sat + kāya; "existent body/group" or "identity") & dukkha and the arising of identity & dukkha the same way, namely:
Pañca upādānakkhandhā sakkāyo. These five grasped aggregates are identity. MN 44
Saṃkhittena pañcupādānakkhandhā dukkhā. In brief, the five grasped aggregates are suffering. SN 56.11
The craving that makes for further becoming — accompanied by passion & delight, relishing now here & now there — i.e., craving for sensual
pleasure, craving for becoming, craving for non-becoming: This is the
origination of self-identification. MN 44
Now this is the noble truth of the origin of suffering. The craving that makes for further becoming — accompanied by passion & delight,
relishing now here & now there — i.e., craving for sensual pleasure,
craving for becoming, craving for non-becoming. SN 56.11
"Sakkāyadiṭṭhi" is to regard/view the five aggregates as "self", as follows:
How does identity view come about?
Kathaṃ sakkāyadiṭṭhi hotī
It’s when an uneducated ordinary person has not seen the noble ones, and is neither skilled nor trained in the teaching of the noble ones.
They’ve not seen good persons, and are neither skilled nor trained in
the teaching of the good persons.
They regard form as self, self as having form, form in self, or self in form.
They regard feeling … perception … choices … consciousness as self, self as having consciousness, consciousness in self, or self in
consciousness.
That’s how identity view comes about.
Evaṃ kho, āvuso visākha, sakkāyadiṭṭhi hotī
MN 44
It follows, for stream-entry to occur, two experiences must occur, namely:
Seeing clearly "identity" is not a real permanently existent thing, which cuts the fetter of identity-view.
Seeing clearly the ending of attachment to the aggregates (sakkaya) and the ending of identity view (sakkaya ditthi) ends dukkha, which cuts the fetter of doubt about the path.
Therefore, at stream-entry, it is known without any doubt that "non-attachment" towards the five aggregates is the Path to Nibbana. Thus, whatever phenomena or experiences occur, such as "jhana", these experiences/phenomena are not attached to or regarded as being or connected to "self".
If the ending of identity is experienced (such as by Sam Harris when taking LSD) but the correlated insight into the ending of dukkha is not experienced & maintained (such as by Sam Harris who, when not on drugs, promotes war & nuclear genocide) then stream-entry has not been attained.
"Doubt" is not doubt about "anatta" ("not-self') but is doubt about "anatta ending dukkha". This is how fake gurus & fake dharma are known; when deeds do not equate to claimed realisations. When the fetter of "sakkaya ditthi" is cut, so are myriad unwholesome selfish deeds; because it is discerned abandoning "sakkaya" results in peace (Nibbana).
add a comment |
"Stream-entry" requires three fetters to be cut, which include the fetter of doubt about the path and the fetter of identity-view.
Also, the Pali suttas define the both "sakkāya" (sat + kāya; "existent body/group" or "identity") & dukkha and the arising of identity & dukkha the same way, namely:
Pañca upādānakkhandhā sakkāyo. These five grasped aggregates are identity. MN 44
Saṃkhittena pañcupādānakkhandhā dukkhā. In brief, the five grasped aggregates are suffering. SN 56.11
The craving that makes for further becoming — accompanied by passion & delight, relishing now here & now there — i.e., craving for sensual
pleasure, craving for becoming, craving for non-becoming: This is the
origination of self-identification. MN 44
Now this is the noble truth of the origin of suffering. The craving that makes for further becoming — accompanied by passion & delight,
relishing now here & now there — i.e., craving for sensual pleasure,
craving for becoming, craving for non-becoming. SN 56.11
"Sakkāyadiṭṭhi" is to regard/view the five aggregates as "self", as follows:
How does identity view come about?
Kathaṃ sakkāyadiṭṭhi hotī
It’s when an uneducated ordinary person has not seen the noble ones, and is neither skilled nor trained in the teaching of the noble ones.
They’ve not seen good persons, and are neither skilled nor trained in
the teaching of the good persons.
They regard form as self, self as having form, form in self, or self in form.
They regard feeling … perception … choices … consciousness as self, self as having consciousness, consciousness in self, or self in
consciousness.
That’s how identity view comes about.
Evaṃ kho, āvuso visākha, sakkāyadiṭṭhi hotī
MN 44
It follows, for stream-entry to occur, two experiences must occur, namely:
Seeing clearly "identity" is not a real permanently existent thing, which cuts the fetter of identity-view.
Seeing clearly the ending of attachment to the aggregates (sakkaya) and the ending of identity view (sakkaya ditthi) ends dukkha, which cuts the fetter of doubt about the path.
Therefore, at stream-entry, it is known without any doubt that "non-attachment" towards the five aggregates is the Path to Nibbana. Thus, whatever phenomena or experiences occur, such as "jhana", these experiences/phenomena are not attached to or regarded as being or connected to "self".
If the ending of identity is experienced (such as by Sam Harris when taking LSD) but the correlated insight into the ending of dukkha is not experienced & maintained (such as by Sam Harris who, when not on drugs, promotes war & nuclear genocide) then stream-entry has not been attained.
"Doubt" is not doubt about "anatta" ("not-self') but is doubt about "anatta ending dukkha". This is how fake gurus & fake dharma are known; when deeds do not equate to claimed realisations. When the fetter of "sakkaya ditthi" is cut, so are myriad unwholesome selfish deeds; because it is discerned abandoning "sakkaya" results in peace (Nibbana).
add a comment |
"Stream-entry" requires three fetters to be cut, which include the fetter of doubt about the path and the fetter of identity-view.
Also, the Pali suttas define the both "sakkāya" (sat + kāya; "existent body/group" or "identity") & dukkha and the arising of identity & dukkha the same way, namely:
Pañca upādānakkhandhā sakkāyo. These five grasped aggregates are identity. MN 44
Saṃkhittena pañcupādānakkhandhā dukkhā. In brief, the five grasped aggregates are suffering. SN 56.11
The craving that makes for further becoming — accompanied by passion & delight, relishing now here & now there — i.e., craving for sensual
pleasure, craving for becoming, craving for non-becoming: This is the
origination of self-identification. MN 44
Now this is the noble truth of the origin of suffering. The craving that makes for further becoming — accompanied by passion & delight,
relishing now here & now there — i.e., craving for sensual pleasure,
craving for becoming, craving for non-becoming. SN 56.11
"Sakkāyadiṭṭhi" is to regard/view the five aggregates as "self", as follows:
How does identity view come about?
Kathaṃ sakkāyadiṭṭhi hotī
It’s when an uneducated ordinary person has not seen the noble ones, and is neither skilled nor trained in the teaching of the noble ones.
They’ve not seen good persons, and are neither skilled nor trained in
the teaching of the good persons.
They regard form as self, self as having form, form in self, or self in form.
They regard feeling … perception … choices … consciousness as self, self as having consciousness, consciousness in self, or self in
consciousness.
That’s how identity view comes about.
Evaṃ kho, āvuso visākha, sakkāyadiṭṭhi hotī
MN 44
It follows, for stream-entry to occur, two experiences must occur, namely:
Seeing clearly "identity" is not a real permanently existent thing, which cuts the fetter of identity-view.
Seeing clearly the ending of attachment to the aggregates (sakkaya) and the ending of identity view (sakkaya ditthi) ends dukkha, which cuts the fetter of doubt about the path.
Therefore, at stream-entry, it is known without any doubt that "non-attachment" towards the five aggregates is the Path to Nibbana. Thus, whatever phenomena or experiences occur, such as "jhana", these experiences/phenomena are not attached to or regarded as being or connected to "self".
If the ending of identity is experienced (such as by Sam Harris when taking LSD) but the correlated insight into the ending of dukkha is not experienced & maintained (such as by Sam Harris who, when not on drugs, promotes war & nuclear genocide) then stream-entry has not been attained.
"Doubt" is not doubt about "anatta" ("not-self') but is doubt about "anatta ending dukkha". This is how fake gurus & fake dharma are known; when deeds do not equate to claimed realisations. When the fetter of "sakkaya ditthi" is cut, so are myriad unwholesome selfish deeds; because it is discerned abandoning "sakkaya" results in peace (Nibbana).
"Stream-entry" requires three fetters to be cut, which include the fetter of doubt about the path and the fetter of identity-view.
Also, the Pali suttas define the both "sakkāya" (sat + kāya; "existent body/group" or "identity") & dukkha and the arising of identity & dukkha the same way, namely:
Pañca upādānakkhandhā sakkāyo. These five grasped aggregates are identity. MN 44
Saṃkhittena pañcupādānakkhandhā dukkhā. In brief, the five grasped aggregates are suffering. SN 56.11
The craving that makes for further becoming — accompanied by passion & delight, relishing now here & now there — i.e., craving for sensual
pleasure, craving for becoming, craving for non-becoming: This is the
origination of self-identification. MN 44
Now this is the noble truth of the origin of suffering. The craving that makes for further becoming — accompanied by passion & delight,
relishing now here & now there — i.e., craving for sensual pleasure,
craving for becoming, craving for non-becoming. SN 56.11
"Sakkāyadiṭṭhi" is to regard/view the five aggregates as "self", as follows:
How does identity view come about?
Kathaṃ sakkāyadiṭṭhi hotī
It’s when an uneducated ordinary person has not seen the noble ones, and is neither skilled nor trained in the teaching of the noble ones.
They’ve not seen good persons, and are neither skilled nor trained in
the teaching of the good persons.
They regard form as self, self as having form, form in self, or self in form.
They regard feeling … perception … choices … consciousness as self, self as having consciousness, consciousness in self, or self in
consciousness.
That’s how identity view comes about.
Evaṃ kho, āvuso visākha, sakkāyadiṭṭhi hotī
MN 44
It follows, for stream-entry to occur, two experiences must occur, namely:
Seeing clearly "identity" is not a real permanently existent thing, which cuts the fetter of identity-view.
Seeing clearly the ending of attachment to the aggregates (sakkaya) and the ending of identity view (sakkaya ditthi) ends dukkha, which cuts the fetter of doubt about the path.
Therefore, at stream-entry, it is known without any doubt that "non-attachment" towards the five aggregates is the Path to Nibbana. Thus, whatever phenomena or experiences occur, such as "jhana", these experiences/phenomena are not attached to or regarded as being or connected to "self".
If the ending of identity is experienced (such as by Sam Harris when taking LSD) but the correlated insight into the ending of dukkha is not experienced & maintained (such as by Sam Harris who, when not on drugs, promotes war & nuclear genocide) then stream-entry has not been attained.
"Doubt" is not doubt about "anatta" ("not-self') but is doubt about "anatta ending dukkha". This is how fake gurus & fake dharma are known; when deeds do not equate to claimed realisations. When the fetter of "sakkaya ditthi" is cut, so are myriad unwholesome selfish deeds; because it is discerned abandoning "sakkaya" results in peace (Nibbana).
edited 45 mins ago
answered 1 hour ago
DhammadhatuDhammadhatu
25.9k11146
25.9k11146
add a comment |
add a comment |
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Hi Eric! I asked a similar question a while ago on the DhammaWheel forum. You may like to take a look at it: dhammawheel.com/…
– Brian Díaz Flores
2 hours ago